Project Geekology
Embark on an epic journey with Anthony and Dakota as they delve into the vast realms of geek culture, from cherished classics to cutting-edge creations. Join us for an exhilarating adventure of exploration and nostalgia, as we unearth hidden gems and reminisce about the moments that have shaped us. Welcome to the ultimate celebration of all things geeky!
Project Geekology
The Rings of Power - Season 1, Part 1
What if Galadriel’s journey was more about inner discovery than epic battles? Join us as we celebrate a milestone—our 100th episode of Project Geekology—with our special guest Rich, a passionate listener who suggested our new series focus, The Rings of Power. Rich shares his creative Mets-themed parody of "Who Let the Dogs Out," inspired by his love for the team, while we recount the rejuvenating experience of Anthony's staycation. We promise a lively discussion that interweaves personal stories, imaginative theories, and fresh perspectives on Middle-Earth.
Together, we embark on a journey through The Rings of Power, exploring its grand visuals and complex narratives. We compare the series with House of the Dragon, reflecting on their storytelling nuances and audience expectations. Our conversation delves into Galadriel's character, examining her evolution from a battle-hardened warrior to the wise figure we know. The cultural dynamics in Númenor and the Southlands add intrigue to our discussion, alongside the enchanting friendship between Elrond and Durin, and the mysterious identity of the Stranger.
Prepare for an engaging exploration of fictional universes that will entertain and enlighten both long-time fans and newcomers. From the ambitious storytelling of The Rings of Power to an intriguing theory about the Avatar: The Last Airbender universe, there's something for everyone. Whether it's the breathtaking landscapes, the powerful musical themes, or the strong character dynamics, this episode offers a rewarding experience for those eager to uncover the layers of these beloved stories.
Twitter handles:
Project Geekology: https://twitter.com/pgeekology
Anthony's Twitter: https://twitter.com/odysseyswow
Dakota's Twitter: https://twitter.com/geekritique_dak
Instagram:
https://instagram.com/projectgeekology?igshid=1v0sits7ipq9y
YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/@projectgeekology
Geekritique (Dakota):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBwciIqOoHwIx_uXtYTSEbA
Twitch (Anthony):
https://www.twitch.tv/odysseywow
Welcome to episode 100 of Project Geekology 100 episodes. We've had our highs and our lows, but we have made it to 100 episodes. I am one half of your host, anthony, and joining me, as always, is Dakota and Anthony.
Speaker 2:We've had our highs and lows. What is this? A high or a low?
Speaker 1:This is a high because I mean, look, we've made it to 100 episodes. When did you say at what episode count? Did you say that podcasts usually end?
Speaker 2:I think the average podcast, if I remember correctly, is it ends after about seven episodes, so I think we've passed that quite a bit. But yeah, 100 episodes. It's crazy. We haven't gotten paid yet. Like when is the paycheck coming in?
Speaker 1:I'm going to call it in.
Speaker 2:You know You're going to call them in Anthony. We're joined by a special guest this week. He's a fan of the show. He's been listening to us for a while. He gave us the idea for this podcast series that we're going to be covering. Starting this episode Guys meet.
Speaker 3:Rich. Hey guys, anthony Dakota thanks for having me. Really excited to be on the show, ready to talk about some rings of power over here and uh, you know, just finally I'm glad.
Speaker 1:I get to celebrate on such a momentous occasion with you guys. Yes, yes, like Rich said, we are covering rings of power. We're going to be setting it up into. Each season is going to be set up, set up into two episodes. We're going to cover the first four episodes in episode one and then the last four episodes in episode two, and so and that's going to be the same thing for season two. So just to kind of break it up, give us a little bit more time to to really talk about and dive into the series, because Dakota and I we kind of talked about it. We thought that a series like this, and even series in the future, they deserve more than just like a one hour episode to cover it and I think we kind of realized that specifically when we covered shogun yes that we just didn't have enough time to dive into the meat of these series because it was such an impressive work and, I think, moving forward.
Speaker 2:This is probably you know, unless it's like a six episode series or a mini series or whatever, breaking series into chunks while we discuss, it will probably better our discussion and allow us to talk about individual topics a little bit more. So I'm excited about the prospect and for those of you who don't know, we've covered Lord of the Rings topics in the past. We have a six episode series on the extended edition lord of the rings films. That's literally as long as the extended edition films. That was way before we had like episode caps and all that, but that's a really fun listen rich. Did you ever get to listen?
Speaker 3:to this. Yeah, I love those I I there's nothing like. You know, my wife was complaining, but she's like I don't understand how you can listen to a podcast that's almost as long as the original work, or possibly longer sometimes, and I'm just that's just how it is. You know, that's almost as long as the original work, or possibly longer sometimes, and that's just how it is you know, that's how it be.
Speaker 2:That's how it is. There's more to talk about in a film like Lord of the Rings than it actually shows us on screen, which is surprising because it's such a long film. But I'm hoping that we don't fall into the same trap with the Rings of Power, because you know we have capped ourselves at around an hour per episode at this point. So we're going to get into the meat of the rings of power very soon. But before we begin, Rich, what have you been up to this past week?
Speaker 3:I was talking to you guys a little bit about before we started the show. I have been working on a little project. So in 1999, when the Mets made it to the playoffs, the radio Z100 here in New York released a song called who Let the Mets Out, which was a parody of the baja men's classic who let the dogs out classic this one was interspersed with different clips of the mets being, you know, like successful moments throughout the season.
Speaker 2:So oh, so it was like a video thing no, so it actually came out.
Speaker 3:I think they had a video, but it came out as like audio on the radio oh, I see, you would just hear like the music under like you know, oh, doggy, I have a bone and while you hear like Mike Piazza hitting a home run.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, yeah, I got you.
Speaker 3:So I did it about 10 years ago. I did an update version and then my son has been begging me to do. He's nine.
Speaker 2:He got into the Mets this year went to like 40 games, so he asked me, can you do this?
Speaker 3:You're crazy, yeah, it took a long time.
Speaker 2:40 games that's amazing, but it's worth it.
Speaker 3:Now on the way to the games. You know we'd listen to who let the Mets out with an updated roster. So it also drills all the players into his head. It's just like you know, like okay, it's like passive mind control.
Speaker 2:Really, it's definitely propaganda of the highest order, but I love it. I love it. Yeah, wow, there is no war in Ba Sing Se Guys. Anthony, what have you been up to?
Speaker 1:Well, I have been kind of like having a bit of a staycation. I took this week off. I know that I was just on vacation visiting family up in Tennessee, but now this week I'm kind of hanging out having a staycation and taking care of things at home and it was actually like a vacation, from your vacation, exactly, you know.
Speaker 1:And then I had like a transition period where I worked like a week and then went back on vacation. But that time off, brother, absolutely yeah, I'm using my PTO and you know it doesn't move over to the next year, so it's kind of like a use it or lose it. So I'm using it. And you know, what was really cool on the day of recording is that Warcraft had their 30th anniversary direct, and so I kind of looked a little bit into that. They announced the next expansion for that whole saga that they're doing, and so the next expansion that they're doing is called World of Warcraft Midnight and that one's actually adding player homes so I guess you can like set up like a home now and wow, wait, wait, hold up, hold up, hold up they like.
Speaker 2:A year ago they announced three expansions. Is this part of that okay? This is one of those, so this is the second of those and they're adding player homes yes, yes okay, so you get to like Animal Crossing it a little bit yeah, you get to set up a home and stuff.
Speaker 1:I wonder how you know. They didn't go too much into detail about it, but they told like, hey, you're going to be able to you know, kind of set up a home, and I guess this is like something that a lot of people have been asking about. They also announced that I know that you and I were talking about World of Warcraft Classic and how far they're going. They're going to go into Mists of Pandaria.
Speaker 2:I don't think that's classic WoW.
Speaker 1:personally, I personally don't think. I think that Cataclysm and on is kind of modern day WoW, I think Past.
Speaker 2:Wrath of the Lich King. That's it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 2:That's it, that's classic.
Speaker 1:WoW.
Speaker 2:Anyway, who am I? Blizzard needs their money.
Speaker 1:I think that they also said something about some of the servers in WoW Classic are going to be moving over to. They're going to shift over to become Burning Crusade Classic, so they're setting up more servers so that they can like just continue to like move to the future. I don't dude, I don't know what they're doing, man, it's so crazy yeah, I'm a little confused, but that's I mean.
Speaker 2:Cool for for people who are actively not playing current wow but are looking to relive the glory days of mists of pandaria, I'm happy for you guys. Or burning crusade, whatever, very cool. What else have you been up to, if anything?
Speaker 1:so also another thing that dropped is they brought back overwatch 1.0. So the day that overwatch 1 came out, they released the 1.0 like day one oh yeah, so I can play.
Speaker 2:I can play hanzo with his scattershot.
Speaker 1:Yes hanzo, with the scattershot, with the the original it's the original four roles that they remember. There used to be a defense role in the game and like you could pick, like six winstons or six torbjorns and stuff yeah, I remember those days I was getting like 17 to 20 kills per game just with scattershot alone.
Speaker 1:It was amazing, beautiful so it's both fun and a little frustrating at the same time, because the game is completely different. The game back then was more team-based. Now you can do a little bit more like solo. You can carry a little bit more like if you if you're a really good player, you can carry a bit more. But like in that game, dude, you can't dive into a team by yourself or you're just going to get melted.
Speaker 1:And I went back and I started playing characters that I never played when the game first came out. Like I was mostly just like a Lucio one trick and then I played a little bit of Junkrat, and so it's weird, like seeing how those characters operated, like back then. Or, like you know, I would mess around with them a little bit, but I never like played them too much. Or, like you know, I would mess around with them a little bit, but I never like played them too much. And it's so weird, like you know, the way that diva plays and then symmetra being the support symmetra again and her having that whole teleport thing and then mercy having her mass res. Do I?
Speaker 2:forget she doesn't have mass res anymore.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's crazy how much they buff and like change characters over time, just like tweak characters slowly and slowly until they're completely different, like play styles yeah, it went from like being a team-based moba type game to, like you know, this like 5v5 kind of brawl it out, sometimes a game mode where, like you know, you could have one person that takes down like two to three people if, like, you're skilled enough. But yeah, so I've been messing around with that. Like that. It's been interesting, going back in time and and doing that and just kind of like enjoying some time off. How about you, dakota? Have you been working on any of your projects? I know that you, you finished your osha 30. It was osha 30, right I did.
Speaker 2:I finished my osha 30. It was a. It took literally 30 hours. Then I took I had to take a whole bunch of other little stuff after that that I'm pretty much done with, but yeah, so as far as like actual work goes, I'm doing pretty good with that. You guys want to hear a theory that I've concocted for the Avatar universe, like specifically the last airbender universe. Yeah, so all right. So this, how do do I say it? This is something that I'm not going to like broadly talk about online but, considering our audience probably won't bleed into the avatar fan base. I don't think this theory is going to go anywhere, but I will discuss it when I release my big avatar timeline, because it has a lot to do with the origins of the world as it is basically. So do so. Do you guys remember? I'm guessing both of you have seen Legend of Korra?
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 2:And you remember the two episodes where they go into the first avatar Wan, correct?
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2:So that's a pretty big moment in the show where it kind of discusses how the avatar, like Rava, met with this character named Wan and eventually had to combine forces to defeat Vaatu, the spirit of chaos and evil and darkness and stuff. But what I found was interesting in that episode? I went back to it because I was looking specifically to see if they had shown a map of the world, because you probably have seen it plenty of times. You probably don't remember it off the top of your head, but the map of Avatar is very specific. You know there's the mainland. On the top right there's the north and the south poles that are separated from the mainland, there's a series of islands to the west that make up the Fire Islands, and then you know the air temples are north, south, east and west. So I was wondering if they had shown or showcased the map of the Avatar world up until that point. And I watched both episodes and I realized no, they didn't. And the reason I wondered this was because in my head I was thinking well, there's this new video game coming out of Avatar 3000 years after the first Avatar, avatar 1. And it's supposed to be. It's supposed to take place during a great ice age where there's a lot of seismic activity. And I'm wondering well, maybe this is how the Fire Islands come to be, maybe the Fire Islands didn't exist in like Avatar Wan's era, and I think there's actually more to it than just that.
Speaker 2:So I started like watching the episode and like getting some details down. And this is a time period where all humans live on the backs of lion turtles, so they don't have need for boats. And if you watch those episodes, there are no boats in the entirety of the two episodes, not even in, like the war montages that occur at the end of the episode that showcase what the four nations are like. Warring over that eventually kills Juan. So there's no boats at this time period. But there is the moment where Juan travels with Rava to the South Portal, which is in the South Pole. So he, there are no boats in this universe, but they somehow travel on the back of, you know, juan, spirit animal or like animal guide, without a boat.
Speaker 2:And I'm wondering, I wonder if this is almost like a pangea event where, like, the entire world exists in this huge continent at this time period. And then this game that's coming out in a couple years, that's tentatively called ice wars, which discusses ice ages, which discusses seismic activity, or if that's the separation of the world, because there's no other way for, you know, wan and rava to have reached the south pole unless it was connected to the mainland. Unless I just caught a big plot hole and I'm just like connecting crazy dots, that's my current theory is that, like the, the game that's coming out, the triple, a game in a couple years, is going to involve some sort of ice age that's brought upon by tectonic shift, and I'm really excited about seeing if I'm right about that the creator is going to listen to this podcast and be like you're not supposed to think of these things, have they?
Speaker 3:announced that the game is. Have they done stuff like that where the game is canon?
Speaker 2:oh it's, it's canton. Yeah it's, it's being. It's it's not only being produced in that universe, but it's being funded by paramount and avatar studios and it's it's like the they're spending the majority of their like budget in terms of gaming on this, like ip. So as far as like canon within the avatar legends universe, it's pretty succinct. They like almost everything is hard canon up to this point. There's comics, there's novels and there's a tabletop rpg that's like that has added plenty to the canon. So I I don't have any like reason to believe that this isn't supposed to be canon that's.
Speaker 3:That's gonna be really awesome. I'm looking forward to that nice. It's like the jedi games. I love that those have become canon in the oh yeah yeah.
Speaker 2:So with that out of the way, I'm sorry for the the tangent. For those of you who haven't seen any avatar or legend of korra, that probably made no sense to you, but hopefully our topic at hand will make sense to you. We're discussing the first four episodes, in no particular order, of the rings of power. So I guess, before we do any of the individual spoilery thoughts on these episodes, how about we discuss the show as we're approaching it as a whole? So we'll start with you, richie. We're talking a little bit about your experience with the rings of power and how you felt coming back into the series. You know, before we started this podcast yeah.
Speaker 3:So, as I was saying before, you know it's weird because I have not rewatched things way too many times. So I watched it once and then, before the second season came out, I watched the first season again. I kind of had the same feelings about it. I'm not really that well-versed in Cimmerillion. I didn't know a lot of the characters I'd heard of new menorah. I like how they were their r's, but I didn't really know much about I like anyone there, you know, and it just felt like a lot of there were almost too many characters for me to kind of attach.
Speaker 3:Appreciate attach to any of them. Then I watched the second season and I really liked the second season and then I went back when I found out the great news that would be coming on the show. I went back to re-watch the first four to make sure I could separate everything in my head and I like it so much more I don't know if it's just interesting going in with more knowledge into it. I mean, I mean, I'm somebody who forces my son to do a full, extended rewatch in one day and have meals punctuated along the day to make sure I I bribe him into staying into it, you know. So I do remember when the two towers came out around christmas. All the way back in 2000, whatever, because I'm ancient, I, my friend, I had convinced my friends that we were we remember that too, yeah yeah, dakota and I, we saw those in the movie theater we were children, but we saw christmas eve
Speaker 3:my friends and I are all hanging out. We're older and I was like, so we're going to still go see Lord of the Rings, right? And they're like, no man, there's like four feet of snow. And I was like, forget you guys. And I walked all the way there and watched it anyway. So I've been a fan of you. Know, I read the books, I read the little lost. So I don't know. I mean, as a teacher, I tell my students you have to reread all the time. I'm telling you the rewatch. It changed my perspective on it completely.
Speaker 2:Excellent, Anthony. What were your thoughts going back into these four episodes?
Speaker 1:It was interesting because you can see the setup for a lot of these characters that you eventually see down the line, like the Harfoot. You can tell that those are ancestors of hobbits, you know, right, and a lot of these characters. Yeah, you were talking about Numenor, which eventually goes along the lines. That's the line that Aragorn is a part of. He's one of the Dunedain, which is part of that kingdom, and so it's really cool seeing the past and certain characters that I had seen also like that were like in Shadow of Mordor, celebrimbor, dude his name is Celebrimbor.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, like he's the main character of that game and so it's weird seeing him in this light as kind of like a little bit into like politics. Elrond he didn't surprise me at all, like he's always been kind of like a politician and that's how he was shown throughout the Lord of the Rings. But you know, seeing the setup of these characters from like down the line Galadriel also, and like her kind of having like this warrior background and then what she like eventually becomes in Lord of the Rings.
Speaker 2:So you know it's interesting seeing these characters years and years before yeah, I had a similar experience as both of you when this was first coming out. This was also coming out at the same time as House of the Dragon, hbo's House of the Dragon and for me that was the far superior show. It was just like week in, week out. I was just floored by House of the Dragon and just a little bit perplexed by Rings of Power, and eventually I dropped off after episode five of Rings of Power, not because I didn't like it, it just wasn't grabbing me, and I think I don't really remember what I was doing at that point, but it just didn't feel like it was worth my time up until that point Going into the series. I was very excited, though, and I think that that was what really was. The big issue was that it didn't meet the excitement that I had going into the series because, you know I I do read a lot of tolkien so rich.
Speaker 2:You were saying you hadn't read the silmarillion. I have read the silmarillion. This has nothing to do with silmarillion. This is like even deeper than the silmarillion. This is this is the appendices of lord of the rings. This is the history of middle-earth which was, like released by his son, christopher, like years after his death, in a series of like just annotated notes of Tolkien that he had written over the course of like 40 years or so, which is a really cool thing. But I've never even touched it. I haven't gone into any of that.
Speaker 2:So this was all new to me for the most part.
Speaker 2:I had you know bare bones ideas of like what Numenor was all new to me.
Speaker 2:For the most part, I had you know bare bones ideas of like what numenor was all about and gladriel's story going from you know the first age into the second age and into the present of lord of the rings.
Speaker 2:But while I wasn't hugely in tune with where these stories were coming from or where they were being sourced from, I was understanding of the fact that they were truncating the you know the second age of middle earth into this storyline and I think that that bothered me to some extent. It doesn't really bother me anymore, but at the time when this was coming out it was just like at the back of my head like man I know this isn't tolkien lore, even though I personally didn't know the tol to that extent. So it kind of bothered me a little bit and that's why I dropped off. I'm really excited to, you know, give this series another shot, and watching these four episodes was really exciting for me because, you know, without the baggage of when it was coming out and all that, it was really cool to be able to just experience it with fresh eyes. And, yeah, I think I got a lot more out of it this time than I did in the past.
Speaker 1:No, I totally agree, and the thing is is that you kind of have to watch this series in a different light than like Lord of the Rings. You know, growing up just watching Lord of the Rings over and over, like throughout the years, you know it really has become one of those like it's like like throughout the years, you know it really has become one of those like it's like a sacred trilogy, you know, and anything that falls short of that quality is like kind of like. You know, and the thing is is that there are elements and aspects of the Hobbit that I do enjoy but it doesn't really come close in terms of quality to me and so if you, if you re-watch the Lord of the Rings series, are you also going to rewatch the Hobbit trilogy?
Speaker 1:No man when I say I'm doing a Lord of the Rings we rewatch. I'm just watching those three. I know people who do watch the Hobbit, I'm like why?
Speaker 2:bother. Oh okay, you're that guy, I'm here for the content put it in my, put it in my veins that's, that's all I want.
Speaker 1:Okay, all right, that's fair. Yeah, exactly, you know, if you enjoy it and, like I said, there are aspects of it that I also enjoy, you know, it's just there's certain things that I wasn't a big fan of, but, like you can tell that with rings of power that there is an attempt to try to stray away from some of the things that stumbled the hobbit a little bit and the show that they're trying not to overuse cg too much. I mean, obviously they use it. There's a lot that needs to be done, like with cg. It would just cost way too much to like do without. But you can see a lot of the practical effects and the practical scenes and I really do like appreciate that a lot yeah, you know, going into this, I was kind of floored by how much I forgot about how good this show looks.
Speaker 2:It looks beautiful, like literally every shot is just like wow, I can use that as a wallpaper.
Speaker 1:Wow, I wouldn't mind, you know, just being there, you know dude that shot of numenor, like when they were coming up on the ship first time.
Speaker 2:Like it was beautiful yeah, no, it was really cool. There's a lot of just real strong, solid beauty in this series, whether it comes to, you know, even like from like the first age, like when they're introducing galadriel as a, as a kid, and seeing the trees that are glowing, that are providing the light for the elves, and all that. It's just gorgeous and you could tell that they did their homework. Like it's impossible to watch this show and be like these guys don't know anything about tolkien, which you will hear a lot of online. So it's amazing what they were able to accomplish.
Speaker 2:But I want to talk a little bit about the music, because there's a lot of musical cues in this that I'm just like this is really powerful, really powerful, and musical cues that I remember from my one viewing of the first five episodes. I think that's all I made it through that. You know Galadriel's theme it's just like so powerful and it plays all the time, but there's not even like the only one. There's plenty of music that just really rings true and it feels lord of the rings e.
Speaker 2:You know, it feels like the howard shore score yeah from the six movies that exist and that's really cool, and I think it was bear mccreary that did the music for this. He he's done a lot of like really cool stuff in like the geek community. I believe he did some of the music for God of War. I think he did music for Godzilla, king of the Monsters.
Speaker 1:He's done some really cool stuff. Hey, man, we've had that a few times with some of the geeky things that we've covered, that you know, like Howard Shore like had like a staple kind of in Lord of the Rings, but then, like you also had like John Williams, that he had a staple in star wars, but then you also had a really good score and the mandalorian, and that was not john williams right, that was ludwig uh luring jorinson yeah yeah, jorinson is a prodigy, honestly, like everything he touches is gold.
Speaker 2:But what's amazing about mandalorian is that it sounds good but it doesn't sound necessarily like john williams.
Speaker 3:It doesn't sound john williams, it doesn't sound.
Speaker 2:John Williams-y, you know, and that's what makes Ludwig's work on the Mandalorian and other shows around it so cool, because it doesn't need to rely on John Williams. But I think what I like about the Rings of Power is that it sounds very Howard Shore-y, like it sounds very Lord of the Rings-y. It sounds very Howard Shorey, like it sounds very Lord of the Rings-y, and you could even be confused as like confusing some of the themes in the show for stuff that could appear in the movies, and I think that that is so powerful.
Speaker 3:I thought it was the same guy. So I don't actually track a lot of this stuff just because of the style.
Speaker 3:I actually thought, if I would, have been in like Cash Cab and it would have been like a true or false or false question. I, I would, I would have bet, I would have bet, yeah, no, it's howard short, true, and then he would be like, oh sorry, and the lights go down, sucks to suck, yeah yeah, so that that the beauty of the show, both visually and musically, is something that just beyond any criticism, past that point, is just flooring.
Speaker 2:It's you talk about like the money spent, and Amazon, notably, spent a lot of money on this show. I think it was like over the course of five seasons they were, you know, willing to spend like 500 million or something like half a billion dollars on the show, and if you break that down, that's about as much money as they probably spent on the first season of the acolyte and I'm a fan of the acolyte, but this is like leagues above the acolyte in terms of just like visualization and stuff like that. So it's amazing what they were able to accomplish here.
Speaker 2:Let's talk a little bit about like characters and some of the the different story threads that haven't necessarily coalesced yet, but we can kind of see a picture forming. Let's start with Galadriel. What are your thoughts on Galadriel, guys?
Speaker 1:she's interesting. You know, like coming into this, I wasn't too sure, like you know, like how I was gonna feel because, like I've seen how she is in Lord of the Rings and so she's so much different. In Rings of Power, you know, she's portrayed to be a lot younger and she's got a lot more impatience and she is like battle hardened, and so it's really interesting to see how she is and then if, like throughout the series, we're going to start seeing her develop a little bit more into, or we're going to start seeing glimpses of the Galadriel that we see in Lord of the Rings.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so like the Galadriel that you're talking about is specifically like she's a queen, but she's also like known as being a witch of the forest and she kind of exemplifies both of those things and you know just her like extreme royal manner, but also in the fact that like she's able to get into the fellowship's head and all that, and you know she's telling them glimpses of their future and like discerning things of their heart that she can't currently do in Lord of the Rings, rings of Power, at least we don't know that she can.
Speaker 2:So I think that that is a really it's going to be interesting seeing how that develops. But we see that Galadriel is almost like a warrior, you know, like she's like you said, she's battle-hardened. She's been fighting this fight for presumably hundreds of years. She's been searching for any hints of Sauron because she knows deep in her heart that Sauron's not gone. He's in hiding somehow, and even like the other elves in her party, like they, they're ready to give up the hunt because there's been no, you know, sign of Sauron for ages right no sign of orcs in years yeah, yeah rich.
Speaker 2:What do you think of galadriel and her story arc over the course of these first couple?
Speaker 3:episodes. So you know, like anthony was saying, I kind of know her more as the woods elf, which you know like and her power there, and even she's briefly in parts of the hobbit, the white council, I think yeah is meeting there and even there she's not. I mean pardon the pun, but regarding this first arc, it's very like joan of archie showing up and I didn't see that coming to be honest, I didn't know that she was going to be.
Speaker 3:You know, I, I basically know from like the movies and my one read of the book, but I didn't go deep into any appendices or anything, so I didn't know this side of her. You know, I will say that I guess I kind of understand the other elves saying that you know they think she's a little kooky for still believing that sauron's out there. But I don't know, maybe it's just, I don't think it's just the knowledge of knowing. I just think, like you know, they all know, sauron is is a bad dude. You know he's hanging out with margarth over there and that's not a good dude either. And I'm just surprised that they're all so quick and maybe it's because obviously a conceit of the show, right, they have to tell us this quickly, they have to exposition this.
Speaker 3:So okay we go into it and I mean, if you kind of think about it, you know, like all of the lord of the rings media, we've seen you go into it and you're like, yeah, I know there's a Sauron. So there's one character who right away is like, hey guys, I'm pretty sure Sauron's still alive. And everyone else is like, nope, can't believe it. And I think, as the viewer I'm almost, I know, I'm supposed to forget that he exists, because I know what happens after. But it makes the other characters look more like buffoons and it makes her look less petulant, you know. But at first, like she's coming off as very, very petulant and very impatient, as anthony said. But I agree with her, you know, it's like she's acting like a jerk. But I'm like, no, I, I get it.
Speaker 1:I mean she's right, you know yeah, with the meta knowledge you're like no, listen to her exactly, guys.
Speaker 2:Come on, you know yeah, I mean, I guess you could look at it as like in the real world, if there's just a guy with, like you know, his contingents of troops trekking through the adirondacks, saying, you know, I know the british are still coming, I know that they're coming and it's, it's been like hundreds of years like I.
Speaker 1:I that's fair the brit brothers are coming that's kind of what I like.
Speaker 2:I mean it's, it's funny. The same, the same logic can be used for, like you know, going back to like the acolyte for a brief moment. The same, you know, everyone's like. Well, obviously, like it was a red lightsaber guy, like a bunch of yada are killed. It must be the sith, but like sith existed for a little what? 900 years.
Speaker 2:At that point, that's like saying the Vikings are coming, like they're making a return so, yeah, I can see why some of the the soldiers in her retinue are just like eager to get be done with this, and obviously there's a huge reward waiting for them back at home because they're going back to their homeland.
Speaker 2:And it's a really, really cool scene when Galadriel capitulates, she goes back to Lindon Lindon is the elf city that we're visiting here and the king grants them the opportunity to journey off back where they came from.
Speaker 2:And it's a really cool visual thing, like I didn't know how they were going to manage it, but it's just like the absence of substance, as they're just drifting off into the east and and just seeing like the clouds and the sky part to just like this heavenly glow. It's like literally pearly gates for them and they're all just like on the cusp of that portal into whatever is left, like past middle earth, and she, just galadriel, she just cannot do it, she can't make herself leave at this point and I think that that's such a cool thing and she jumps ship and you know, eventually it lands and like on a raft with hal brand and all that, and I think that is a really interesting little arc and I think that that's partly like where I lost the plot a little bit past that point, because I wasn't a huge fan of numenor specifically or like the politics and like the goings-on of the people of numenor at that point when I first watched the series. What are your thoughts on numenor and, like the people in the city, I didn't.
Speaker 3:So I'll be honest with you, I I I couldn't understand. I mean, it became obvious that it was elves versus humans and and there's kind of a sentiment rising here but at the same time.
Speaker 3:I think you're right. I think what happened was I was just trying to wrap my brain around this idea that you know, gladriel is supposed to be kind of off her rocker and and she's believing in something that doesn't make sense anymore. She jumps off, gets onto the raft and now, instead of like going back and dealing with her stuff, then we go off to Numenor and I was like what's going on here? So I this is when I think the b plot, or whatever you want to call it, coming in here like so quickly intertwining, I I would have. I think it would have benefited a little bit. Again if you're a little bit more uninformed. I think that if you spent a little bit more time with Galadriel's reaction there, I understand that numenor ends up becoming a way for her to get where she needs to be, but I was a little confused. Pharazon has fantastic hair, I will say so. I loved that and that's the the speaker yeah, yeah, muriel's cousin pharazon or pharazon
Speaker 2:something like that, yeah, and he always has this like extremely cocky grin on his face and it's like, it's like lifting up his beard, it's like it's a, really it's great hair, very punchable face.
Speaker 3:He's very, he's, he's very the.
Speaker 2:The one thing that there's no getting around is he's very, you know, immediately, like almost vaudevillian bad guy, you know yeah, I, I personally I I haven't really seen much past this point, so I don't know if he's a good guy or not. I just know that he is a current antagonist of galadriel. So he's a bad guy to me, you know. But then so is the queen of numenor, so you know, and then there's that whole plot. But let's not get too bogged down, anthony, you haven't mentioned your thoughts on numenor. Before we jump away from it, Numenor.
Speaker 1:So it was interesting. The city was beautiful, like honestly, like the actual space was amazing, but it was really cool with some of the people that were introduced. I mean, dude, a huge character in the Lord of the Rings universe, was introduced in Isildur, so we know his story, we know his story. It's all his fault. His fault. Dude like Lord of the Rings would not have happened if he would have tossed that ring into the fire.
Speaker 2:You know so right things are his fault, man things are afoot and it's mostly Isildur's fault and you know, a lot of things are Isildur's fault because you know he's like in the naval I don't know what it is, it's like a naval academy sort of thing that he's trying to yeah the seaguard.
Speaker 2:Okay, yes, and he is like, what is he even like longing for? Is he longing for his home back in Numenor? Or is he's longing to go to Middle Earth? What is his goal, I don't know. Like he keeps getting like daydreams while he's doing something extremely important and it ends up costing, like him and his friends, like a position on the ship that they were, you know, at least his friends were trying to get on for like their entire lives. So it it's interesting rich. You're being very quiet, so I'm assuming we're entering spoiler territory and I don't. I don't want to know what happens past that point.
Speaker 3:So I'll keep it safe, I'll keep it secret. Yeah, well, next week we'll talk about the latter half of the season yeah, whenever you guys say something that I'm just gonna say, I'll keep it safe, I'll keep it secret I like that.
Speaker 2:Okay, I I do like most of the cast that they introduced in numenor. I think they were interesting enough, if not just extremely one-sided characters, and I think that is also like a turnoff for me in some ways, but like they all seem like I'm supposed to be like the smart father character or like the wise father character. I'm supposed to be the scholarly daughter character.
Speaker 3:So you get a lot of like characters.
Speaker 2:I'm excited to see how they get entwined in the overall plot with Halbrand and Galadriel and all that going forward. But we'll talk about that in a future episode. Let's talk a little bit about what's happening in the southlands. What are the guys? What are the characters names?
Speaker 3:I don't even remember bronwyn bronwyn is the, the woman with the dark hair. Her son is theo. Yeah, and uh aranadir, I think is the elf aranadir.
Speaker 1:Yeah, aranadir is the the elf and you know, the cool thing about the southlands is that you know a lot of stuff that we talk about is gonna obviously trickle into lord of the rings territories. But it's interesting, like what the southlands are, like what it is, what it becomes. It becomes mordor dude. Yeah, that was really interesting.
Speaker 2:That was a really interesting little right detour they took when they were in numenor. They went to, like the library of lore or something like that, and they matched up this symbol that galadriel had been seeing for who knows how long, like in regards to sauron, with the.
Speaker 1:You know the shape of the mountain range that will eventually become Mordor right, which is it's like a beacon of sorts like go there, that kind of thing yeah and if you're evil, we got a spot for you over there prime real estate yeah, so yeah, it's interesting.
Speaker 1:It's like, wow, you know, because we know what what Mordor looks like in Lord of the Rings. It's, you know, devoid of grass and trees, it's all ash and all burnt up, but like this is like the grasslands, it almost looks like rohan, you know an interesting choice that they had specifically with you know, the orcs that were inhabiting like the underground area of the southlands.
Speaker 3:Is that we're not, we're not, we're not racist. Here is is uruks they're. I thought the uruks were later no, you're thinking of the uruk high, the orcs in this series. Uh, get offended. If you call them orcs, they it's like a, it's a pejorative term and they're just the uruks okay, very, very interesting.
Speaker 2:I don't think have have they gotten offended thus far. I must have, unless that happens later. You got you, man, you got you okay, all right, so the uruks, thank you.
Speaker 3:I just, I just don't, I don't know, I don't like for that kind of, that kind of talk on the podcast. So this is 100 episodes, like you know what if we have? Our audience is listening right now. They're going to be very offended by what you just said they're going to be very turned off.
Speaker 2:You know, just sitting there in in their like darkness, just like brooding and their in their tunnels that they're digging yeah, meat's off the menu, boys.
Speaker 1:I thought that was interesting, that the way for them to avoid sunlight is like digging underground and then that was cool and like tunneling under people's homes and then like kidnapping them and making them dig dude. That's insane yeah, I.
Speaker 2:What's really funny is that kind of happened in brooklyn recently like not not not oryx, but it's something that actually happened, like it's a real thing.
Speaker 2:That happened in brooklyn recently where a Hasidic Jewish community decided that, you know, like I guess they were breaking off from their temple, so they were their own space underneath Brooklyn and it was a crazy story. And I remember there was like a guy online who, like for like a year, was saying that there's Jews under his floorboard, like speaking in Hebrew, and and nobody believed him. They thought that he was just being a racist, but like that was actually something that was happening.
Speaker 1:He thought that some boar rat thing was mean. Dude, I have to look this story up next Because it sounds hilarious it happened, like within the past year, it's the funniest story you must have died laughing when you found out about that yeah, no, there's.
Speaker 2:There's like footage, it's it's crazy, it's like it's really funny, like it's just a wild thing that happened. So that was in the back of my head when theo was saying that there's mice in the floor and he starts attacking the floor.
Speaker 3:It's like somebody's sitting there trying to put their kids around the southlands and they hear the black speech under, under, under the floorboards yeah, oh, those mice are talking again.
Speaker 2:Oh man, but I do think that that was really cool. I thought that the way that they portrayed the uruks at this point was just fascinating, and I liked that they couldn't get into sunlight. I thought, you know, like giving them like vampire powers and like weaknesses was kind of fun.
Speaker 1:Right, well, and they've always kind of shied away, shied away, right, I think it was the Uruk-hai that were the only ones that could kind of run out in the daylight. Correct? Yeah, that's a good point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I forgot about that. Yeah, so that was kind of the whole. Yeah, that's why the Fellowship was like so surprised that they were being chased by Orc was because they're not supposed to be, you know. So that was, that was cool. So seeing that in this episode was really interesting. And we have so Arandir and Bronwyn have this like unspoken relationship where they just meet up every now and then, just meet up every now and then and you know, arandir and elf bronwyn, a, just a female human of presumably low birth, you know, like she's she's just in a village, you know she's not, yeah, of any particular royal line or anything like that.
Speaker 2:It's a very interesting dynamic to have developed and obviously bronwyn and theo are like chastised within town because of her relationship to the Pointy Ear, as they call them. You know, like they like to, you know, throw derogatory marks at the elves and stuff, because they've basically been occupying the land ever since they were, you know, faithful to Sauron back in the day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that their like ancestors were were pretty much they had sided with soran morgoth, that was yeah, so like that bothered the humans. They're like you know, why are you guys still here? Why are you watching over us? Like that was so long ago and you know, and in a way, like he's kind of right, the blood of their ancestors still kind of run through their veins there's a scene in the final episode that we are going to cover today, where what's the guy's name, waldron I think, was like the innkeeper.
Speaker 2:He is very clearly still loyal to Sauron and it's almost, it's almost like you think of, like the Nazis that fled to Argentina. And you know, south America, you still have people who are totally, you know, still Nazis. You, america, you still have people who are totally, you know, still Nazis, you know, and they're totally okay with it, and they like to look back at the glory days of their ancestors who moved to the country. And you, I kind of felt the same vibe was being introduced with these people who are still, at least quietly, faithful to Sauron and his Oryx. At this point, right, like, did you get a similar vibe to that? Is that what I'm supposed to be? You know? Kind of attributing that to, it seems that they're.
Speaker 3:The thing I find that to be interesting is the townsfolk are very we're supposed to see them as closed-minded. We're not even supposed to kind of see their way like. They immediately come off as kind of like racist towards elf and closed-minded. The elves don't present to be like some sort of police state where, like the villagers can't do as they please. It's just like the elves are there just making sure nothing happens. I don't think they're rounding anybody up the southlanders right, yeah destitute.
Speaker 3:I don't know if waldron is loyal to sauron or knows that they're destitute and not doing well, and if they pledge to Sauron, then they can get out of this. You know, it's like if a group of people openly picked somebody who is terrible to be a leader just because they thought he would get him out of something. I think that that's the point.
Speaker 2:No, it never happens in real life. Never happens in real life. But I do like the analogy there and I appreciate that fantasy and science fiction is able to kind of like shine a mirror on history and on present events and current events in ways that aren't super in your face but, if you like, dig deep into them. It kind of explores how people think and how people react when pushed against a wall. So, yeah, I thought that was pretty cool. What do you think about the I guess, star-crossed love affair or not like really a fair but like love of bronwyn and arandir, like what does he see in her, what does she see in him? Is it?
Speaker 1:all right go ahead, go ahead I was gonna say like there was obviously something that was already established kind of there when we first meet them, you know, and so there's a lot that we just don't know about like their relationship. Obviously, you know he's been around and so maybe there were some pleasantries over time. They got to talk and got to know each other and then you know a relationship kind of blossomed from that. But other than that, you know, there's not much to go off of other than, like some of the stuff that we have seen, like he came back and he saved Bronwyn and Theo from these orcs that were chasing, that were chasing Theo, and then she comes to help and then like he kind of like helps save them both from from them.
Speaker 2:So that was such a cool scene I had to like rewind it because I was just like amazed at like the the slow motion action in that scene where, like he pushes theo, he sees an arrow coming in slow motion, he catches it and then notches it and shoots it right back, blowed my mind.
Speaker 2:I I had to rewind and just like uh that was very much so like a legolas thing that you would see yes, yes, and I think that was like stuff like that is what made legolas my favorite character back when, you know, lord of the rings was a thing, and that's why, like, for the longest time, I was always playing like rangers and hunters and characters like hanzo and overwatch who had a bow. Like I'm just drawn to that, like as, as soon as I see a bow, I'm just like, that's me.
Speaker 3:You're drawn to a bow, I'm drawn to a bow. I see what you did there. I see what you did there.
Speaker 2:Also, I think that Bronwyn is just. You know, she's a single mother, but she's also extremely well-spoken. She's like a powerful woman who doesn't like take crap from anyone, and I think that he really respects that.
Speaker 1:You know, despite all of the shortcomings that were laid upon her, she's like a strong woman yeah, aside from her like obviously being poor, like she's still, she's still like well kept, you know, like she's, like she's not really all that unkempt, you know oh yeah, no, she's, she's, she's a beautiful lady.
Speaker 2:We can, we can say that. But yeah, so, speaking of strong women, we should head over to Durin and his wife and the Elrond story. That is quite interesting. We have Celebrimbor introduced to Elrond early on and he is tasked to help create a great forge, which you know. I can only assume what they forge in this great forge, but I'm assuming it goes on fingers. So a lot of anticipation going into whatever caleb rimbor's got up his sleeve. It makes me think, like, how did he come to this idea to create this forge? Is he being manipulated behind the scenes? Are a bunch of people being subtly manipulated to an end that sauron is eventually going to, like you know, hold over them? I don't know. I again, I have not watched past episode five of the first season at this point and I only re-watched up until episode four this time around, but I did really, really love elrond's relationship with the, the prince of the dorvan nation, durin. What are your guys thoughts on on that?
Speaker 1:and, like you know him having to, like, show his worth to his friend who he hasn't seen in 20 years yeah, and you know I I just thought that was so interesting that you know durin is right like 20 years is a long time and it may not be much time to an elf but for a lot of us, like dude, like for a human, even dwarves I know they live longer but like, not as long as an elf does.
Speaker 1:But dude, like 20 years, like that's not pocket change, like to an elf, like it's like dude. You didn't even come to see me and the man got married, the man has kids and like Elrond wasn't there so he was very much so, like he was in the right to be upset with Elrond and I mean, come on, dude, like you know dwarves, especially in the Lord of the Rings universe, like they're stubborn people and like when you're on their bad side, like you really got to work to get on their good side, as they really got to work to get on their good side as an old dude who's coughing right now because I'm old.
Speaker 3:I just want you to know. I kind of picked Elrond's side here. You know I get it, I'm the elder statesman on this. There are times where I'll see a friend who lives not that far and I'll be like, hey, it's crazy that we haven't seen each other in 14 months. So I felt Elrond's side, I felt attacked by Durin. I was like, yeah, I've missed stuff. All right, buddy, we're old now this is what happens, right, you know, you call.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're not in high school anymore.
Speaker 3:Now you call your friend three or four days after their birthday, and that's acceptable.
Speaker 1:Well, I think it depends on how like strong that relationship was. Like I feel like it's okay if it's like, you know, maybe a friend, but like not somebody super close but like you know, like being married and having kids is definitely like something huge in in like people's lives. And so if you see somebody that you know you deem as a really close friend, that doesn't even like reach out, then like I would feel some type of way like okay, well, does this person not want me in their lives anymore? And then you also have to understand that you know he kind of he knew that elrond was there for for more than just the reason to catch up with old friends, and so he felt that and so that kind of was like that was like insult to injury, like okay, well, you're showing up here out of nowhere you want something from you want something from me but you you don't even have.
Speaker 1:Like you know, you weren't even there from important parts of my life. But then you want this.
Speaker 2:My question is. My question is did durin send an invite? Because that's, that's a big you know? Like, how was I supposed to know? I haven't seen you in 20 years. I didn't know you got married. Like, come on.
Speaker 1:I mean, I guess, with the suspension of disbelief, possibly, you know, I'd like to imagine getting an invite from. It was a stone. It was like a stone tablet Like they like chipped it out and they like sent it. I liked the tree that he had there, yeah he gave him the tree.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, like the sapling that he had given Elrond or he had given Durin years ago. He had grown Even in the dark. That was cool.
Speaker 1:But it shows how much that friendship meant a lot to him, because his wife was like. He treats it like it's his third child.
Speaker 2:And what's cool is that he doesn't have a heavily adorned home, so that is like a statement piece. It's a huge statement piece. One home so that is like a statement piece. Like it's a huge statement piece. One corner of his house is just this massive tree, so it obviously means a lot to him.
Speaker 1:He thinks about this elrond guy every day and he's always talking to his wife, disa, about how much he misses this guy and he doesn't show up, I like when they were talking about the story of like how they met or like how elrond had saved him, but doran said that he had saved Elrond. So yeah, that like little jab and back and forth that they had and their friendship was really fun. I do, I actually did like that friendship a lot. You know, it's just like two completely different people and you know they kind of like saw through their differences and established something really special.
Speaker 2:What are your thoughts on Disa? I think the idea of someone singing to the mountain to like almost pray to it, which I guess it's a really fascinating idea, a notion because, like dwarves, live their entire lives within stone, so obviously they would make that their gods in a way, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So being able to communicate with the mountains and express that in interesting ways. I thought that was really cool and that kind of ties into like the intro of the show itself, like the actual cinematic introduction that they play before every episode.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, you have I don't know that there's like an actual term for it, I'm sure there is. I don't know that there's like an actual term for it, I'm sure there is. But certain vibrations, certain harmonic frequencies, like, develop different patterns in sand and this is like an actual phenomenon. Like, if you get like a square plate and you play different rhythms or different frequencies, the different frequencies will come up with different geometric shapes within the sand. And that's what was happening in the introduction to this show, and I think that has something to do with what deesa's up to in terms of, like, being able to harmonically resonate with the mountain itself. I think that that's just a cool concept and I don't know if they're going to explore that at all, but it's something that's always fascinated me rich.
Speaker 3:Do you guys have said that the, the deesa, doesn't have a beard? If I remember correctly, gimley said that. You know there, uh, there are dwarf women, but uh, that since they have beards, they're not often recognized.
Speaker 2:And this, this dwarf woman, was very clean, shaven, well, I mean she does have like stubble under her, like, like jowls like not necessarily like a beard, but like there's a little bit of like, they definitely shaved, they shave, they have all right, or like a, like a Brazilian wax or something every once in a while.
Speaker 3:She's a shaver, Probably not like Brazilian like Rohirrim wax or Numenorean wax, something like that. Right yeah.
Speaker 2:Give me the Balrog wax, please.
Speaker 3:That looks hot. You got to be careful.
Speaker 2:Too deep and too greedy. It's interesting you never really think about when they first discover a new ore, like Mithril, yeah, but you could tell immediately when they opened the chest and they didn't show it to the audience, but you knew what it was. What else are the dwarves mining at this point? Yeah, so it's kind of cool knowing that this was a unique thing that they had just discovered. Elrond doesn't even know it exists at this point, but yeah, I like that too. I thought that was really cool and I really like the secrecy that Durin like requests of Elrond. I don't know if Elrond's going to keep it. I assume he's a stand-up guy. I wouldn't put it past him to keep it. But I think someone else is going to find out about it. I think keller brimbor is going to find this, or you know, hanging out in in his belongings and like I'm gonna use this to make a ring, a very special ring. So it might happen rich. Don't tell me if it does, but keep it safe, keep it secret he's gonna keep it safe.
Speaker 2:He's gonna keep it secret. We're gonna we're gonna touch on this later also like.
Speaker 1:So now, like you know, we're we're coming up on an hour and 10 minutes as of recording, so we talked a little bit about that. I don't know if you had anything else that you wanted to say, but we have a whole other side of the story that we haven't even touched on it, which is the harfoots.
Speaker 2:Yes, the harfoots and that, that crazy guy that falls out of the sky. I really I like aspects of what they're doing with the harfoots, like there are like interesting qualities that are very, you know, hobbit centric yes that they exhibit. They're very nomadic people.
Speaker 1:They hide away from men and stuff, but they don't like adventures and, like there's always one, there's always some hobbit out there or, uh, some harfoot hobbit. You know that wants to do something. You know they want to go out and adventure and and nori is definitely one of those you know inquisitive types that wants to like know more and wants to see what things are about I love that her name is.
Speaker 3:So she's brandy foot and I wonder if at some point, like there becomes a loose relation to mary in some way. Isn't he like brandy brandy buck?
Speaker 2:oh yeah, yeah, I mean, what's interesting is that, like their names are all very similar, so I'm assuming these families will you know intermix at some point yeah like spread out.
Speaker 2:But we know that hobbits in the lord of the rings era are very stuck in wherever they are in in hobbiton and the shire. Like they, they've made that their home. They live there. There's no adventuring past that point. They don't go on. You know caravans and stuff, but the harfoots in this era are nomadic. They don't have a home. They're constantly on the move and I think that's kind of cool. What do you guys think?
Speaker 1:I like that they sound irish, yeah, so they have a very like irish accent and like there's some people that have like scottish accents and then, uh like british accents and stuff. It's so like you can tell that like all of this takes place in some european type, you know land I think it's interesting that you mentioned that because I wonder they do have different accents some of them.
Speaker 2:Some have more of a Scottish brogue than, like, a British accent and stuff like that. So I'm wondering if there are different collections of Harfoots that exist in the world that you know. They travel with each other. They kind of break off and they go their own route and these different parties collect in different areas. As they are, you know they're nomads, so it'll be interesting to see where they land. You know, eventually they're gonna have to settle down into the shire and you know the rivers of that area. So yeah, because you know, prior to them becoming shire folk or you know hobbits specifically, they're gonna end up becoming that. They'll land on wherever you know.
Speaker 2:Smiegel and his friend were you know they were it really is yeah, we'll see what happens there. What do you guys all right? One thing that I I particularly did not like and I guess it makes sense for them, but I there's. There's one scene that, like I really cringe at. It's like something like we walk in a line and nobody gets left behind. We walk in line, nobody gets left behind, and it's like wheels on the bus go round and round.
Speaker 1:You know that's their like. The cub scout chant, you know their little mantra dude it.
Speaker 2:I, I rolled my eyes, I, and I think I, I I rolled it last time I saw it, I don't know why, and I'm thinking about it. I'm like this is very much like something a hobbit would do, but I feel like hobbits would have a little bit more colloquial prowess with their words, like Bilbo was very eloquent in his delivery of lines.
Speaker 1:But I guess not all hobbits were. I mean, but, dude, like, look, they're living in hobbiton, they're in the shire, they're a lot more established. So I'm pretty sure that you know they have stuff established. These people are very nomadic. They're very, like you know, they're living this, like you know, kind of gypsy lifestyle and yeah, like moving, moving along, you can't you can't, you can't look for for good poetry from the hunter-gatherer civilizations.
Speaker 3:You have to wait till they become agrarian before the beauty and splendor of the hills and the flowers really starts rolling out in their art.
Speaker 2:Okay, that's words of wisdom. I will allow the Harfoots to develop as the series goes on, but I do like them for the most part and I really like Nori and I really like Nori's friends, their little relationship. It's very Frodo and Sam. Yeah, poppy, it's very Frodo and Sam.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely, and they're very curious, and you know that I want to kind of see what's going on here, because they go and check to see the man that falls out of the sky. You know, the stranger.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so rich. Please, please, don't tell us who the stranger is, cause I actually don't know. Still, I have my suspicions, but I don't know for certain.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I haven't looked at myself to. I'll keep it safe.
Speaker 2:I I know, you know, I know about like sauron that was all over the internet. I'm not going to talk about it here, but I don't know about the stranger, so I'm I'm interested to see, like, what they do with that, because it's obvious that he was one of the valar or the mayar, basically like angels of eru iluvatar, who was sent to middle earth to basically guide the people. So I'm guessing he's one of the five wizards, at the very least yeah he exhibits some characteristics that gandalf also exhibited.
Speaker 2:Like he speaks to insects, he is obviously very close to hobbits and like little folk like that.
Speaker 1:That's like very gandalf. You know, I was thinking that that same thing they probably have already named. Whoever the stranger is at this point, dakota and I are just speculating. You know so, we know that there's a whole, the rest of season one and the entirety of season two, you know. So we're coming at this with like fresh eyes, so we're covering it as we're watching it, and so, but yeah, no, I, I totally agree, and and it and it, for me it's like, makes sense, because he has such a good relationship with the hobbits and the lord of the rings that it's almost like this is where that love of the, the shire folk and stuff would establish would be like I came here and they helped me.
Speaker 1:They were the first ones there to help me yes, yeah, and I think that that that is a very strong point towards the Gandalf line of thought.
Speaker 2:But you know, he could be Radagast. It would be an interesting twist of fate if he turned out to be Saruman. But I'd also like to meet the two other wizards that are never named, at least to my knowledge, in Tolkien's work the Blue Wizards, so I don geese work. The blue wizards, so I don't know.
Speaker 1:I'm most curious about the stranger. When it comes to the rings of power right now, the one thing rich is in the background like dying, because he probably knows the answer I.
Speaker 3:The only thing I will say is that, like I think that you have and this is why I talked about how, like after where I am, and then going back and watching it, I I appreciate the show so much more. It's just you get like smacked with what in the first four episodes easily. I mean, if I say 40 characters, I don't think I'm far off you have what three to four different locations and then you have two mysteries who is this guy and who is that guy and I just think that it was really ambitious and I think it can easily turn people off if they don't really want to get into it. You know, like I think that that's why maybe look, I was watching house of the dragon at the same time and I, because I'm a slave to routine, kept watching brings a power, no matter what. But I was enjoying house of the dragon much more in that first season, you know, and even the.
Speaker 3:I was enjoying house of the dragon much more in that first season, you know, and even the, even the first half of the first season. Comparing both of them. There was no comparison. And you know, I and I enjoy, I mean, you know, give me everything, give me dragons, give me magic. I love all that stuff and I can like it in different ways, but I do think that, like, what they were doing here was just super ambitious and creating so much kind of confusion that it was a little jarring, unless you're kind of really locked as, as the kids say now locked in lmao, you know yeah, for real, for real.
Speaker 1:but yeah, you're definitely right and it's the way that like society is kind of like with the growth of the Internet and stuff, like we really want to know like the answers to things almost right away, whereas I do like we watched like an entire series that was comprised of like one giant mystery and then several smaller mysteries and lost, you know, and and so like we didn't care about it. But it's like now it kind of like bothers us, like oh my gosh, they didn't explain this, they explain that.
Speaker 2:well, maybe at some point they will, you know, hopefully, fingers crossed you know, speaking of which, there's like a little anecdotal thing that jen and I, my wife, experienced where we were watching parks and rec and one of the characters says he's talking about Twin Peaks and he has a line where he says you know, I was re-watching the end of Twin Peaks and it all makes sense, it all comes together. I don't know how they did it, but it all comes together. And I was like, you know, I should really watch Twin Peaks. I've never watched Twin Peaks before.
Speaker 2:So my wife and I think there was two seasons of Twin Peaks and nothing was answered. It had the biggest cliffhanger I've ever experienced in a TV show and then the show was canceled and it's the craziest like non ending of all time. And I thought that that was just such a I know this is like really off on a tangent, but I thought it was such a funny like gag on Parks and Rec's behalf to trick me into watching Twin Pe peaks so that I would be confused, as the writers who were, who were clearly let down by twin peaks.
Speaker 2:But anyway, I hope that that does not happen with lord of the rings, the rings of power. But uh, I think we're gonna close out our first episode there, unless we have anything else to say. Any any final thoughts on the first four episodes, guys, I mean.
Speaker 1:So so far I have been enjoying it a lot more. This like kind of second time I stopped around the same point that you stopped. I think I stopped at four. So the next like few episodes are going to be like things that I haven't seen at all totally fresh, nice nice rich.
Speaker 3:I, I'm really enjoying it. The rewatch is super fun. I obviously need to slow down a little bit, so my apologies on that one, but I, I, I really I'm really enjoying it.
Speaker 3:I'm telling you, like, for me, going back to it, it's, it's. It reminds me of when I started reading game of thrones. I think I got 80 pages in and I just got overwhelmed. So I watched half of the season maybe, like yeah, but I watched about half the season and I was able to then put faces to all the characters and then I went back to the book and then I was able to really take off and it's almost like getting and you know what? I think it's a gamble, because I think that modern audiences, like you were saying, anthony, are so impatient, they just want to know everything right away, and mayhaps we're conditioned that way, myself included to the point where now I'm sitting at a point where I'm excited to hear what you guys are going to say. I'm really excited for you guys to watch it.
Speaker 3:I want to end this episode and be like no guys, but really go binge it now Because I want to get into everything. So I appreciate you guys having me on for this monumental episode.
Speaker 1:It's been a blast. Yes, episode 100. We did it.
Speaker 2:This is actually the last episode, guys. Thank you all for listening, leaving it on a rings of power.
Speaker 1:Cliffhanger, just like.
Speaker 2:Twin Peaks. Twin Peaks style guys, thank you so much for listening to us here for our 100th episode of Project Ecology. Please be sure to give this episode a review, if you are capable of doing so, and, specifically, if you're going to give us a review, you're going to have to give us I think it was what four stars, three stars, anthony.
Speaker 1:Oh man, never. It's got to be five, but not just any old five stars, it's got to be a juicy five star review. You know, type some stuff if it allows you, if not, don't worry about it. But as long as it's a juicy five star review, it bumps us up in the uh, the algorithm and and uh brings in more listeners think about, you know, the tomato that that guy bit into in lord of the rings, and, and that's the juice that we're talking about here.
Speaker 2:It's got to be five stars, guys.
Speaker 1:Are you talking about Denethor?
Speaker 2:When Denethor yeah, when Denethor, like during that song that Pippin's singing. Good times, Guys. If you want to check out any of our socials, please be sure to visit the show notes down below. You'll find anything all of our locations. Rich will also link you, if you'd like, sure, and you can go ahead and follow rich and see his mets escapades, because he's got a lot of mets escapades, a lot, a lot of them, guys. Thank you so much. Have a good one bye y'all.
