Star Wars: Tales of the Empire

Prepare to embark on a stellar journey with Anthony and Dakota as we commemorate our 80th episode by navigating the Star Wars universe's expanse. From the charm of 'Tales of the Jedi' to the latest 'Tales of the Empire' series, we dissect the art of storytelling that defines these epic tales. We'll connect the dots between series, comparing the narrative styles and time periods they represent, all while reveling in the celebration of Star Wars Day. It's a fan's dream discussion that promises to enrich your appreciation for the galaxy far, far away.

Gear up for a hyperdrive switch to tech territory where I'll recount tales from a recent tech conference, and Anthony will get you amped up over his PC build adventure. We'll also mount a spirited defense of the Star Wars prequels—our fresh takes on 'The Phantom Menace' and 'Tales of the Empire' might just challenge what you thought you knew. And as the hum of Formula 1 fills the air, we tease future debates on the sequels and 'Return of the Jedi' that you won't want to miss.

Our final descent takes us deeper into the Star Wars mythos, exploring Ahsoka's evolution and fear's grip on the lore. We'll pore over the intricate web of character development, with a special focus on Barriss Offee's turn to the dark side. Plus, we'll speculate on future explorations within 'Tales of the Jedi' and 'Tales of the Empire', especially those involving enigmatic figures like Qui-Gon Jinn and the Grand Inquisitor. For a session filled with rich insights and passionate fan musings, join us for a podcast episode that's as expansive and unpredictable as the Star Wars saga itself.

Twitter handles:
Project Geekology: https://twitter.com/pgeekology
Anthony's Twitter: https://twitter.com/odysseyswow
Dakota's Twitter: https://twitter.com/geekritique_dak

Instagram:
https://instagram.com/projectgeekology?igshid=1v0sits7ipq9y

Geekritique (Dakota):
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBwciIqOoHwIx_uXtYTSEbA

Twitch (Anthony):
https://www.twitch.tv/odysseywow

Transcript

Star Wars Celebration and Discussion

Speaker 1 0:00

Welcome to Project Geekology, episode 80. I am one half of the hosting Inquisitors, 11th brother Anthony, and joining me as always is You're trying to make me come up with a number like an Inquisitor number on the spot.

Speaker 2 0:16

I'm Dakota, I guess, 12th brother, whatever, I don't know.

Speaker 1 0:22

This week we are covering tales of the Empire, so I you know I had to go with an inquisitor thing then all right, and you know what?

Speaker 2 0:31

the number 80, episode 80. We've finally come to something that kind of sort of aligns with the, the topic of discussion. So, as episode 80 in 1980, empire strikes back, came out, yes, this is not a discussion of empire strikes back.

Speaker 2 0:49

We might touch on it, we might not where you did that but tales of the empire is what we're covering and yeah, so kind of kind of sort of works. I'm a little proud of the connection and, yeah, I'm excited to talk about the brand new, uh six-part show on disney plus. If you haven't checked it out already, it's an easy watch. It's probably like an hour and a half altogether.

Speaker 1 1:09

Super quick yeah.

Speaker 2 1:11

Yeah, you can watch it in a sitting. It's about the length of a movie and a lot happens. We're going to talk all about it, but before we do any of that, anthony, what have you been up to this week?

Speaker 1 1:22

Man, a cramming dude like you know, watching this, and then I also happen to watch tales of the jedi oh okay, so all right.

Speaker 2 1:33

So this is the first time you've ever watched tales of the jedi. It's been out a couple years now it has caught up.

Speaker 1 1:38

Yeah, it's uh, it's always been on my list, but like you know how it is, man like you put things on your list there's so much, there's so much, there's just so much yeah dude like I have, like probably not probably I I have years worth of books to go through as far as star wars.

Speaker 2 1:53

So oh my god you've been like you.

Speaker 1 1:56

You've been reading them as they come out.

Speaker 2 1:58

I have not I've been reading them as they come out and I'm still behind. Like I, I'm reading eye of the Storm right now, or is it called Eye of the Storm? Let me just double check that. I believe it is.

Speaker 1 2:11

Eye from the Storm.

Speaker 2 2:13

The Eye of Darkness is actually what it's called. There's so many names from Archeon Role. I'm reading the Eye of Darkness now and that's a relatively new um high republic book, phase three, and yet I'm a couple books behind on top of that.

Speaker 2 2:31

So, umbra, my cat's going crazy I know I was like, wow, that's pretty if I could hear it's probably loud on your end what's crazy is that, like when we got this cat, he barely meowed at all, like he was like so malnourished like we didn't think that he could meow, like he would like open his mouth, and it would just be like, you know, like he was trying to meow but like it was nothing coming out. And then you know, like all of a sudden, you know we moved to this new location and he's super talkative, uh, like extremely talkative, especially at five 30 in the morning. So, yeah, that's, that's what we're dealing with now. It's like what's up y'all? Yeah, he's just like time to eat, guys. Come on, let's wake up.

Speaker 2 3:15

Let's go. Dad, I know you gotta get work. Uh, get ready for work, Any who's yeah. So what did you think of Tales of the Jedi?

Speaker 1 3:22

I thought it was really good. I thought it was insane that it covered certain points. It was like it really filled in some holes that you're like okay, what happened here? What happened?

Speaker 2 3:37

to this, specifically with Dooku.

Speaker 1 3:38

With Dooku and the mysterious disappearance of Yaddle.

Speaker 2 3:44

Yes, and they did it in one story that like that that was.

Speaker 1 3:48

that was one episode I definitely would like to to cover this like I do. There's definitely there's some. There's a lot of parallel that happens in um tales of the empire and tales of the jedi like between, like the different, different.

Speaker 2 4:06

So I haven't seen tales of the jedi in a couple years right, okay, pretty much pretty much like the week that it came out.

Speaker 1 4:12

I made a video and I don't think I've like I don't think I've touched on it since, right right, so I mean I'll I'll talk a little bit more about it yeah, yeah when when we when we actually get to the discussion of of tales of the empire but I definitely would like to I that tales of the jedi deserves its own episode. I think it would be messed up to like kind of cram both shows and then you probably would want to watch it again before actually discussing it.

Speaker 2 4:41

I'd like to, I'd like to re-watch it at some point. Um so, before we you know, while while it's all fresh to you, which did you prefer? Because ultimately, they are different shows even though they have a very different like style?

Speaker 1 4:55

I mean, obviously, tales of the jedi, but mostly because, mostly because I'm biased, like I just I love the clone war show and like it was so much so it was pretty much clone wars, like I mean, that's what it was, you know, yeah so tales of the empire was a lot closer to like rebels. It was like that rebels era so I I guess that that that's what you could say. Like one is like clone wars, one is rebels but a little bit, yeah.

Speaker 2 5:27

Yeah, yeah, it's different periods of time.

Speaker 1 5:29

Yes, yes, so, but yeah, no, I, I I had watched that. Um, so we're we're covering this because this past weekend was star wars day. We had may the fourth and revenge of the fifth, so that's why and and and return of the 6th there you go.

Speaker 1 5:52

And so we decided like, hey, let's do a star wars and celebration of, like you know, kind of star wars week. So this past friday I actually went to go see. I went to go see the Phantom Menace the the 25th anniversary. They they have the movie playing in the theaters right now. They have the movie playing in theaters right now. And yeah, man, it dude. I, I will always love Phantom Menace. I understand the gripes, especially the ones aimed towards Jar Jar Binks, but I do not think that Ahmed Best deserved that kind of hate that he got. I just don't think so. It's not his fault, man. He didn't create this character. He just look, man, let me tell you it. Could you imagine? He probably grew up on Star Wars and it was like yo, man, like they want me to be in a star wars movie, I'm gonna do any character. I mean, let's be real.

Speaker 2 6:47

Like and same thing goes for young jake lloyd yes, yes you know, I think even more so for jake lloyd. You know that he he actually had and probably still is going through, um, you know, actual therapy because of his time on star wars, which is not something anyone should ever have to deal with. Right, you know, for something so many people love the fact that, like he was given hate as a young child, you know yeah.

Speaker 2 7:15

And ended up in a psych ward because of it. Crazy, like, absolutely like. He did fantastic. You know, I saw it this weekend as well. He may not be the best child actor of all time, but like he embodied that role, he did a good job I mean, he was a kid.

Speaker 1 7:30

Come on dude, like yeah, what are you gonna do? But the thing is is that sometimes we forget who these movies are made for of course. Yeah, you know, of course so yeah, and I do feel like ahmed best has kind of redeemed himself quite a bit now um yeah you know, he had his own little game show yeah and he reprised the role of that jedi master and yeah, and what was it in?

Speaker 1 7:56

was it mandalorian I think it was mando season three okay, yeah, so, and dude that his scene was like absolutely I think Was it Mando's season?

Speaker 2 8:04

I think you're right. Yeah, it was.

Speaker 1 8:05

Mando Grogu. I think he saved Grogu.

Speaker 2 8:07

Yeah, he saved Grogu. Yeah, that's right.

Speaker 1 8:09

So I mean the fact that like they gave him a really awesome scene was I was glad that they did. You know, they kind of like were like you know, let's give you a proper role so and I proper role so and I do a cool role and I read it's a cool role, right, it is. It is. I read kind of like he is. Well, I forgot what his, his jedi master name was, but he was known for like being the the best out at like lightsaber dueling I'm gonna look it up really quick.

Speaker 2 8:39

Uh, keller and beck, master, keller and beck yeah, I think he overs.

Speaker 1 8:43

He was like the overseer of of lightsaber, uh combat which is an awesome role, you know yeah, I mean if he, he was considered the best, so there you go. Yeah, I thought that was cool so but yeah, you know, aside from from this, it was cool kind of going back to to watch that man, like seeing that pod race on it's so good.

Speaker 2 9:06

I was thinking while watching it. I was just like this is genuine gold, like if somebody came up to me and decided you know, like hey, dakota, you're, you're the perfect person that we want to write a star wars novel. What would you pitch? And I would be like a three novel, like like a three novel series, like a trilogy about a pod racer going from nothing to something, and I think that would be so fun because pod racing is so cool, um, and there's so much drama that happens behind the scenes. When with within pod racing just you know, within within this, the Boonta Eve race that we have in this movie Obviously it's the pivotal scene that you know allows Anakin to leave Tatooine and all that.

Speaker 2 9:52

But you can do so much with that, like with a sports type story or like a racing type story. You can do so much with like a big cast of characters too. I almost kind of if you've ever watched the uh, the formula one show on netflix where they go season by season of formula one and they like follow the um, the different racers there's 20 racers in total, um, from the different teams and I could totally picture that working in like a pod racer setting and dude, it would be. It would be awesome it'd be so cool.

Speaker 1 10:23

It's funny that you mentioned that, because I actually got into F1 like this season of racing.

Speaker 2 10:30

Yeah.

Speaker 1 10:31

Yeah, I started watching F1. And one of my friends he recommended me to check out that show. So, yeah, I had started watching that show.

Speaker 2 10:41

So yeah, so, funny enough.

Speaker 1 10:42

There's a lot of drama. It's like really behind the drama, like it's like you, oh, really behind the scenes.

Speaker 2 10:46

It's crazy like, and they like really like play it up in the in that show too so f1 would not be a thing in the states right now if it wasn't for that netflix show like that boosted the numbers of f1 so much they decided to bring f1 races back to the states and they've had a few races back in the states at this point.

Speaker 1 11:04

Yeah, dude, we literally this weekend. Like in Miami right Recently, Literally this weekend, yeah, like on Saturday, they had the sprint and then on Sunday they had the actual Grand Prix. Wow, that's awesome. It was here in.

Speaker 2 11:20

Miami. That's cool, yeah, so stuff like that. You could tell so much story with that. I do highly recommend the Netflix show because it goes behind the scenes. It'll interview everyone before and after the race and everything and like all the drama of, like you know, managing these teams and it's not, and it's not even like, it's not even just like.

Speaker 1 11:41

You know, drama with, like drivers moving teams. It's like drama with teams, you know, going to another company because their engines are better.

Speaker 2 11:50

You know like oh yeah, yeah, like there's so much, there's so much little minutiae that can like happen within that kind of stuff. So imagine that like a star wars setting. I would love, I would write the heck out of that, like that would be the funnest thing to write.

Speaker 1 12:04

That'd be so cool it would. Also, you would have to dive into uh podcasting, uh podcasting, uh pod racing lore I'm already.

Speaker 2 12:13

I'm already a podcasting master. But yeah, if you're listening to this, you'll understand. You know, yeah, but yeah, that.

Speaker 1 12:20

That that was, you know, being able to to go back and see episode one, and you know I had that. Well, I also went to that tech event this weekend. Uh, that was actually really cool that. That really also showed me that I need to really work on my linkedin oh man, I bet, so tell me about a bit, so a lot of it was.

Speaker 2 12:46

Work on my LinkedIn.

Speaker 1 12:47

Dude, absolutely. I just like people at these events will be like oh, what's your LinkedIn? It's like asking somebody for their Instagram, essentially.

Speaker 2 12:59

Hey, what's your MySpace?

Speaker 1 13:01

Dude. Yeah, but it's like LinkedIn, because this is like a professional setting.

Speaker 2 13:04

I know, I know.

Speaker 1 13:05

But it was really cool because I felt like I learned a lot, Not just that, but also stuff within like the tech industry, and you know I made some connections and yeah, man, it was cool. Like I definitely it definitely got me motivated to really like press into to to what interest, what I'm interested in.

Speaker 2 13:29

So yeah, man that's exciting.

Speaker 1 13:31

Yeah, that was really fun. And yeah, man, I have something to say and I know you're not going to be happy about it, but you know it's it's persona related, man.

Speaker 2 13:43

You got to lay it on the line.

Speaker 1 13:46

Tomorrow I am receiving my persona PC case.

Speaker 2 13:52

Congratulations, little clap for my fellow podcaster, my podcaster.

Speaker 1 14:03

You know.

Speaker 2 14:03

so I'm definitely going to have to send pictures, send pictures oh my goodness, you might as well put it in the show notes, why not? But?

Speaker 1 14:09

I have been lazy, though, like I need to actually start ordering the parts. I've been second guessing some parts, so that's what's kind of been setting me back, but I, I'm, I'm gonna, I'll get it. I'll get it built sometime this month. That's the goal.

Speaker 2 14:27

Cool man, I'm excited. I'm excited to see the final product. Anything else you've been up to. You seem like you've been jam-packed.

Speaker 1 14:36

Yeah, I know right, it was definitely a jam-packed weekend. It was a good weekend. I got a lot of. I didn't obviously watch the F1 race in Miami Not actually going there because it's absolutely ridiculously expensive and anything F1 related is super packed and I'm just like, nah, I'm going to eat my tacos at home, I'll watch the race live. Yeah, because the actual Grand.

Speaker 2 15:01

Prix landed, I'll actually see more.

Speaker 1 15:04

The actual Grand Prix landed on Cinco de Mayo.

Speaker 2 15:07

Oh, okay, cool.

Speaker 1 15:08

Yeah, so you know tacos and racing. Tacos and Tuesday, but yeah, man aside from my jam-packed weekend of doing all this and watching Star Wars. What have you been up to, man? I feel like I've been babbling.

Speaker 2 15:22

No, you're good, You're good. I've been doing similar-ish things. I didn't watch the f1 race, unfortunately, and I didn't go to a tech conference but, I did watch tales of the empire, which is good because that's what we're talking about today, and uh, I, I, like I said I watched, uh, phantom menace in theaters, so good, not on May the 4th. I did watch it on Revenge of the Fifth.

Speaker 1 15:48

I saw it on the Phantom Third.

Speaker 2 15:57

You watched it?

Speaker 1 15:57

on the Third Awakens. The Third yeah, there you go, dude. I don't know where I was going with that. The Third of. Skywalker, is that the Phantom Third?

Speaker 2 16:11

It's a good movie. Man, I will never let anyone tell me that it's a bad movie because it's not, there's so much good about it and it's so Star, so star wars that like you can't tell me not to like it honestly to tell you the truth, even with attack of the clones being at hate, as hated as it is, it's still very much so. Star wars exactly, and it's hard not to like just because it's continuing but that's what my problem with the sequels were.

Speaker 1 16:42

I know we'll talk more about it, but that's where a lot of my problems lied. Okay, all right, we'll get. We'll get to the sequels were. I know we'll talk more about it, but that's where a lot of my problems lied.

Speaker 2 16:46

Okay, all right, we'll get to the sequels in short order, maybe later this year.

Speaker 1 16:50

We still got to cover.

Star Wars and X-Men Discussions

Speaker 2 16:51

Return of the Jedi, I believe. Yeah, yeah. So we're very close to the sequels. Guys, we got to take a little break so that we can discuss all the X-Menmen films which you know, next week we should cover x-men 3 yes, uh, last stand last stand? I think not, you know not, x3 no no because that is vulgar and inappropriate and we shouldn't say that on a podcasting uh you know, or podcast application a podcasting application that's probably why I did decide not to go with that probably I can.

Speaker 2 17:27

I can only imagine. You know the discussions behind closed doors. You know speaking about. You know inappropriate discussions in regards to the x-men films. Did you watch the nickelodeon uh documentary that came out recently?

Speaker 2 17:42

uh called quiet on set I started it, but I did not finish it's definitely worth it, um, in terms of, like, the bigger revelations come out in the last couple episodes and it's, it's, it's a difficult topic to talk about. Obviously, you've probably heard that, like, drake bell came out as uh, claiming that he was, you know, uh, sexually abused by, uh, one of the producers of the show. Right, right, but uh, yeah, he was like, according to him, he was, um, abused by brian peck, one of the producers. Guess who does the commentary for the x-men film, which one, the first one, the first one.

Speaker 2 18:24

Yeah, brian singer and brian peck do the commentary for that first x-men film, and brian peck is actually in the movie.

Speaker 1 18:31

He's the hot dog stand owner, uh, on the beach oh, I remember when, when senator kelly, kelly water, yeah, yeah, so that that's crazy wow what a, what a insane, insane story that.

Speaker 2 18:46

Anyway, I don't want to talk too much about that, just because it's, you know it's it's heavy, neither here nor there, really it's heavy.

Speaker 1 18:52

I don't want to I don't want to talk about it anymore anyway.

Speaker 2 18:54

Um, what else what? I've been listening to the star wars high republic novel, uh, the eye of darkness, which is the start of phase three of the high republic, which follows the events of phase one.

Speaker 1 19:09

It's really confusing how many phases are they going with?

Speaker 2 19:12

three. As you know, this is the third and last phase of the high republic novelization push. Basically, phase one takes place um, or it starts 200 years before the phantom menace, so 232 bby. The second phase does that whole prequel thing where they they go back further in time. They went 150 years before phase one, so that's like 382 bby. That's when that starts. And then the third phase is after um. It's a year after phase one, so it's 229 bby or something like that.

Speaker 2 19:49

So they went like back to the future in phase three they went back to the present almost, you know, because it's it's like shortly after the events of phase one but like phase two is like long before the events of phase one. So it's, it's, it's a little weird the way that they did it. I like all the stuff, or most of the stuff. I should say I like most of the stuff that they've produced and I'm enjoying the beginning, the intro to phase three. You know, without getting too spoilery, like at the end of phase one, the, the nihil threat of the galaxy, they kind of win, they, they kind of defeat, they find a way to defeat the, uh, the republic and or the jedi, at least in some huge, uh, noticeable way. And phase three is basically like the republic and the jedi coming to terms with that it's and and phase two is explaining basically like how the nihil managed to do that. So it's kind it's a, it's a big convoluted story, but it's a really cool story.

Speaker 1 20:47

So really it's like it presents the story, Then it shows like how it got to that point, and then it's showing pretty much the and then now phase three is like the aftermath of all of that.

Speaker 2 21:00

Yeah. So phase phase two is like the very, very, very early, like makings of the nihil, like the, the enemy organization for those of you who don't know that inhabits the galaxy at this period of time in the high republic right and they have this like crazy way of being able to navigate hyperspace different. Yeah, it's it's, it's really cool, but it's, it's it. But they explain it in a way that is so unique and exciting.

Speaker 2 21:28

Right, right Because it's different than anything you've experienced in Star Wars before. Yeah, I'm really enjoying the beginning of Phase 3. Of everything that happened 150 years before phase one, and like how the nihil began and like like where they got the quote-unquote weapons to defeat their, their jedi, uh, ally or not allies, enemies. You're starting phase three with a new perspective, which is a cool concept, but it's so much work to get to that point. It's like 20 books at this, at this stage. It's like so much, so much novelizations and stuff like or not novelizations, but you know it's so many novels, so many comics and so on, but I'm enjoying it. Uh, that's pretty much what I've been up to lately. I've also been continuing to play afk journey. I'm enjoying that. Just, it's something to play while, you know, I'm on my breaks from work or whatever. So, yeah, any more. Fallout 4 uh, I did play a little bit. I I not not a whole lot, probably put another couple hours in it. Nice, good time do it?

Speaker 1 22:37

have you heard anything down the grapevine about like what's the next era that star wars is going to be exploring after they finish up with the high republic?

Speaker 2 22:49

not particularly. Uh, so it's. It's kind of difficult to say because they kind of star wars currently has is dipping its toes in so many different eras. Um you, you have books that are coming out between, like you have comics that are regularly coming out between empire strikes back and Return of the Jedi. Most likely, once they catch up to Return of the Jedi, they'll continue past Return of the Jedi. I'm assuming that's what they're going to do.

Speaker 1 23:13

I kind of want to read that Darth Maul one that's coming out. I heard that that one's pretty crazy.

Speaker 2 23:19

I think it's like Red, black and White or Black Red and White or something like that Black, white and Red, I think that's what it's called. Yeah, I've heard good things about that too, so that's pretty cool. They've got so much content coming out. They have the Fallen Order games, the Jedi book, the Jedi games that come out like in between the prequels and the, the original trilogy those games are so good, man they have.

Speaker 2 23:44

You know, tales of the tales of the empire, tales of the jedi, where, like you have stories before the prequels, you have stories after the original trilogy. You know it's, it's there. They have so many different publishing initiatives right now and um time periods that they're exploring, which is exciting, but it's also a little overwhelming at times. And of course they have plans for a dawn of the jedi movie which comes, which takes place supposedly 25 000 years before the the saga. And then they have a sequel movie which is supposed to star daisy ridley. So there's a lot going on. Yeah, they're, they're. You know how much of it will be good, how much of it will be bad, I have no idea. I'm looking forward to it. Just, you know, at face value. And of course, the acolyte comes, comes out soon. It's a hundred years before um, the phantom menace. So it's like exactly, uh, bisecting the phantom menace and phase one of the higher public. So yeah, it's, there's a lot going on. Man, you want to talk about tales of the empire?

Speaker 1 24:45

hey, yes, let's, let's uh, hop into it, man now that, yeah, that we're like we're on the topic of star wars might as well, might as well what were your thoughts on it?

Speaker 2 24:57

like you kind of asked me, so I was a big, big, big, big fan of tales of the jedi. For the most part, for the most part, I was a big fan of tales of the jedi, and I'll tell you the one story that I didn't like, and it was the one where ahsoka fought the inquisitor that's the last one it's the last one of tales of the jedi and the reason I didn't like that one was because it completely overwrote the ahsoka novelized novel by uh ek johnston not my favorite novel, but I love the story.

Speaker 2 25:31

You know like it's. It's for me it's part of the star wars story. So when you tell me, like, when you give me a book, whether I like it or not, it becomes an immovable object in my mind in terms of like the overall story of star wars right.

Speaker 1 25:49

Yeah, it's like you know, if you're gonna put a book there like you guys gotta really do your homework to try not to like retcon stuff unless it's like problematic problematic stuff, you know.

The Evolution of Ahsoka's Story

Speaker 2 25:59

It's not problematic. There's nothing problematic about this book, and that's the thing. Like it was originally, like a story that Dave Filoni pitched, that was like taken over by one of the writers and they made a story about it. So this final episode I forget what the title of the episode is, but the final episode of Tales of the Jedi completely overwrites that novel. There's no way that those two stories can exist within the same continuity. So much is different, but also parallel. It's the exact same story, truncated into a 15-minute video, but with slight variations story truncated into a 15 minute video but, like, with slight variations.

Speaker 1 26:46

Okay, and I think you had made some comments about that when we're actually covering the ahsoka show that like I think I had made some comments about ahsoka's lightsabers, um, and I think that I had talked about because I hadn't seen tales of the jedi at that point, right at that point. So and honestly, I haven't even like read the ahsoka book. So, like I I just got information like that.

Speaker 2 27:09

I had kind of like looked up and so, yeah, I think you had mentioned like oh, you know that stuff was retconned pretty much yeah, it's hard to tell, like what is and isn't retconned from stories that were like overwritten and ahsoka, that that book by ek johnston was overwritten.

Speaker 1 27:27

So don't be overwriting.

Speaker 2 27:29

My girl like that, and it's not the first time that dave filoni has done that. He's done it a anything in tales of the empire, which was a good thing. I just didn't like the stories as much, if that makes sense. I just wasn't as invested in the stories of Tales of the Empire as I was Tales of the Jedi with Dooku and Ahsoka.

Speaker 1 27:54

And this is why I was saying I really wanted to watch tales of the jedi, because I do feel like there's a lot to be said between the both. I you know, I I do want to get more in depth in like tales of the jedi, like its own episode, but I do want to say that like one of the biggest reasons why I like tales of the jedi so much more is because it's it's clone wars. You know, there's more. There's more story surrounding the, the stories that took place in tales of the jedi whereas tales of the empire were taking, stories that started to happen in the expanded canon.

Speaker 1 28:35

You know right, yeah so I do like that they explains why morgan elsbeth became who she you know, who she is sure, and I do like that they that they brought barris back. I thought that that, like you know, her character was interesting. The last time we saw her she was convicted, you know she, she was in prison, so to pretty much see what happened to her after that. I thought that was interesting and that she kind of like it's like she like lost her way and the and what happened to her in the clone wars was the start of that, and so they they kind of continued that story so she kind of she she kind of had to fall to rise back up, you know, and I really liked that that Barriss was like you know she, she was her care.

Speaker 1 29:32

I feel like her character was believable, like there's no way yeah there's no way that every Jedi that became an Inquisitor was fully, 100% sold. They're like, yeah, you know what the Jedi might have been wrong, but this is a lot more wrong. You guys are no better. And at least the Jedi were trying to help people, whereas you guys are just mowing people down.

Speaker 2 29:56

Yeah, so there's a discussion to be said. Yeah, so there's a, there's a like a discussion to be said, like how much time actually passes between episode four, when barris is inducted into the inquisitors, and episode five, when she decides.

Speaker 2 30:06

You know, this isn't really for me, because in episode four she basically has to compete and and kill a fellow former jedi yeah for the role of being one of the inquisitors, even though she doesn't really even know that it's you know what, what she is going to be. She just wants to be included. She thinks she's doing the right thing by joining this new group of, you know, elite whatever even then she's still very like, resistant, like she didn't want to kill this individual no, of course not, of course not.

Speaker 2 30:37

Yeah, she's, she's still, I think, you know, even though she fell away from the jedi path, and you know a number of people did the jedi were not perfect by any means, but even though she fell away, she was still, she still had. I guess I don't morals isn't the right word that I'm looking for, but she had, you know, standards for right and wrong.

Speaker 2 30:59

Uh, that she followed, you know, and I appreciate that right but when you know it's, it's kind of interesting that she was willing to kill a fellow former jedi for the right to become an inquisitor, but when she realized what their ultimate role was was to capture, you know, unassuminguming Jedi on the run and kill them or take them prisoner, and then realizing that was wrong, it's an interesting arc. You know it's a very like abrupt. Not that it's a bad thing, I don't think it's a bad thing, it's realistic. You know, like once you realize what you're actually doing here, you know, like you get hired on a new job.

Speaker 2 31:36

You don't know what you're doing, but you're going to go above and beyond on your resume. You're going to kill your fellow candidates. Once you get into the job you realize, oh, I'm a bad guy. Maybe I don't want to be and that's kind of the.

Speaker 1 31:53

Right, right. So, while she might have not agreed with the Jedi, she still had this moral obligation, like you know, or this moral. She had these morals that told her, like you know, this isn't right, you know, especially when you know her method of extracting information of Barriss and Lin, her fellow Inquisitor. They're both. I don't know what planet were they on?

Speaker 2 32:20

I don't know what planet were they on. I don't recall actually. Yeah, I don't remember what planet they went to to find that one, you know, unnamed Jedi.

Speaker 1 32:28

Right. So yeah, they're. And so Barriss's method is still very soft, like hey, you know, look, I'm, you know, I'm just trying to help you guys out, whereas lynn is like very much so, like she's like completely sold into what the inquisitor is about and embarrassed like even. Yeah, like like we said, like for the beginning she's not really a hundred percent sold and so, and you saw, like she put herself between lynn and child because, like Lynn just went on a killing spree.

Speaker 2 33:05

Yeah, yeah, you're talking about the third episode. Okay, yeah, and the third episode is actually quite interesting because that's another episode. We don't really know how much time has passed, but we know, we see that. We see that barris offey has aged pretty dramatically, while lynn has not, which is interesting because barris is a mary allen who are known for living long lifespans. At least recently they're known for living long lifespans. So in in the acolyte, there's going to be a character named, uh, vernestra row, a fellow mary allen. She's, she's bald in in the show.

Speaker 2 33:42

But she has purple hair and you know the high republic, she's over 100 years old. She looks like no more than 40 years old in the show. So that kind of begs the question, like why did barris, who was presumably a teenager in the clone Wars, already super aged up I would say late 40s, early 50s by the end of Tales of the Empire? And the prevailing theory that everyone seems to have is that because she's become a healer, because she's giving her own life force to heal people, she has inadvertently shortened her lifespan. Or maybe not inadvertently, that's probably the wrong word but she has, you know, taken life from herself to give to others, which is actually a kind of cool concept. I think um the youtube channel star, was explained was the first to like come up with that theory sounds like it would check out.

Speaker 1 34:38

Sounds like it would check out, I agree, I mean it's cool when the community kind of starts to come up with different theories and then down the line. Sometimes those theories are either validated or shot down. But it's really cool.

Speaker 2 35:04

We do get a tragic end for Barrissris maybe. Maybe we get a tragic end because it kind of leaves it open-ended at, which, in star wars terms, means definitely still alive. Uh, yeah, you're right. I mean, you know you know what?

Speaker 1 35:14

you're right, because we literally saw mace windu get his arm cut off and like pushed out from like super tall building and people are convinced that he's still alive.

Speaker 2 35:24

So yeah, and you know what you know, so like being stabbed like you could definitely like survive and ahsoka survived a confrontation with vader, you know yeah, it's true darth Maul got cut in half, woke up as a spider and I guess in a way there was that you know she died and they brought her back.

Speaker 2 35:59

There's something that was rewritten right there actually that's the one thing that they said wasn't rewritten. So at the end of uh, dark disciple, what's, what's my? Quinlan voss, he, just he's. He and obi-wan put her in like one of the night sister, like pools of like I don't know green liquid or whatever, and that's the prevailing theory. That like brought her back to life, like it was like part of uh, you know, like uh, I don't even know, I, I there's, but apparently like that's still canon, like that story that she died and I guess now she's back for whatever reason actually.

Speaker 1 36:40

So that's that and that's actually a good like transition.

Speaker 2 36:44

You know you're talking about night sisters this is how the the series starts off with the night sisters while we're still like in this transition period, I want to like highlight the juxtaposition of the two main arcs, like the, the baris afi stories, um, that are in the later half of the season, and the morgan elsbeth stories. Baris went from a place of darkness and she found her way out, and that's actually like the name of the final episode of tales of the empire is the way out. But the opposite happens with morgan elsbeth, where and I like the way that the, the episodes are titled the path of fear, the path of anger and the path of hate, just like yoda said, like fear leads to anger, which leads to hate, which leads to suffering, you know, and basically that's, that's the path that barris chose, or not barris? Uh, morgan elspeth chose, after, you know, grievous, and the separatists destroyed the night sister society right, and so this is where where I thought things were in interesting.

Speaker 1 37:54

This series started off with tragedy and death, whereas tales of the jedi started with happiness and life oh interesting, I hadn't even considered.

Speaker 2 38:06

Yeah, because ahsoka is born in the first episode, right and it starts.

Speaker 1 38:09

It starts off bright and happy but ends in tragedy, whereas this kind of is like almost the opposite. Whereas it starts off bad but then there's like hope at the end, because it's kind of cool.

Speaker 2 38:22

Yeah, no, that's that's. I hadn't even considered that, and I'm really happy you brought that up, because that's something that I hadn't I hadn't even considered.

Speaker 1 38:29

Yeah, that's a really good parallel yeah, as I said, there's a lot that connects them and, whether or not that was intentional, I I think it was, I thought it was, I think it was, yeah, yeah I mean, you know like it's almost like, yeah, the, the, the rise and fall of the right, or yeah, the rise and fall of the jedi, and almost like the rise and fall of the empire yeah.

Speaker 2 38:52

So what's interesting with um? You know, like, while we're talking, tales of the jedi and tales of the empire, uh, tales of the jedi doesn't really have tales. I mean, they are tales of jedi but, like, both of those characters end up leaving the jedi.

Speaker 1 39:10

You know, dooku decides to become a, a sith obviously he becomes lord tyrannus and ahsoka decides that she is no longer a jedi after the clone wars and stuff I do, but there's, I do like the tales of the jedi yeah, yeah, I do like the story of of dooku and, like you, find out why he's called a count yes, I thought that was cool uh dooku, dooku jedi lost or lost jedi jedi lost.

Speaker 2 39:38

Yeah, that's a great, great book, but yeah, that um yeah, it was.

Speaker 1 39:43

I really liked you know, and I was like I don't I don't want to like talk too deep on you know tales of the jedi, but I do like I think they're intertwined.

Speaker 2 39:52

You know, it's one of those things.

Speaker 1 39:53

They are so like intertwined, but it it was interesting to see some of these other characters coming back in Tales of the Empire, such as the Grand Inquisitor, and we got Darth Vader and just yeah, their training methods, how they're like so like completely opposite of the Jedi, whereas they're like let go of your hate as far as the Jedi, but the Inquisitors, they want you to hold on to that hate and it's like, yeah, the Inquisitors are, it's like's like a Sith order, like the Jedi order, but for Sith, you know.

Fear in Star Wars Lore

Speaker 2 40:45

Yeah, technically they're not Sith by name but they're Dark Side followers. Basically it's hard, it's really hard to differentiate, like, what makes a Sith versus an Inquisitor or like other you know Dark Side acolytes. But yeah, so I kind of like that juxtaposition. Actually, speaking of you know the difference between like choosing fear and hate versus not doing so. We have, in the first episode of tales of the empire, the path of fear. Right after her entire people, her entire, like the witch, uh, the witches of Dathomir are destroyed for the most part, except for her and Asajj Ventress. Really, right afterwards she's taken in by the Mountain Clan, which is actually, you know, it's referencing a clan of individuals from Legends called the Singing Mountain Clan. It's another Dathomir tribe, basically, and I'm always kind of impressed because eventually everything that's in Legends is going to somehow come into canon at some point, because that's been the case for everything so far.

Speaker 1 41:57

You know, I'm glad that you said that, because in my mind I was just thinking like there's so much in canon that a lot of us have been begging for and we're like, we're like, and it seems like it's slowly trickling in. They, they, you know, gave us the darth revan. Um, I know that there's people that really want Kyle Katarn to enter in the actual canon, which would be really cool. Honestly, I would like to see Kyle Katarn. I don't know if you played any of those games.

Speaker 2 42:30

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And actually in the Kenobi show that came out a while back, obi-wan Kenobi, the child that showed up at I forget the fake Jedi's name, but on that one planet there was the fake Jedi who was interviewing people to lead them to safety. The child that was brought to him, kumal Nanjani, played the role. The child that was brought to him, um, in the credits was titled corinne horn, and that's a a popular legends character from like the new jedi order. So it's, you know they're slowly bringing characters back. You know it's, it's only a matter of time before, like you know, your favorite characters are brought back into the fold. But anyway, with with the, the mountain clan that they bring up, I really like the juxtaposition of like With the mountain clan that they bring up. I really like the juxtaposition of the Dathomir. Witches were the dark side users on Dathomir the mountain clan are the light side users on the plan.

Speaker 1 43:35

I noticed that.

Speaker 2 43:37

Yeah, I totally noticed that there's an interesting balance there. Quick, because there was a line that the, the mother of the, the mountain clan girl, said. That really was a I thought was pretty eye-opening and worthy of discussion, actually. So the mother of the night sister or not the night sisters the mother of the mountain clan, um, she says do not give your fears such fertile ground to take root, and that's a, that's a light side sentiment, you know, like don't let, don't give into fear, don't give, which will lead to anger, which will lead to hate right, it's like you don't, you don't want to go down.

Speaker 2 44:17

Yeah, you don't want to go down that path. And then what? What does morgan elspeth do? She gives into fear and she ends up getting that that mother's daughter, nani, killed in the process. And at the end of the episode she goes. It appears your path is set, morgan Elspeth. I pity you, for I can see what is to come, and the episode's title is the Path of Fear. So Morgan Elspeth literally took the path of fear in this episode, which sets her entire future, which is really cool to me. I just love that. You know the way that they did that. And also like they visualized the force powers of the Mountain Clan, which, if I remember correctly, are completely unique. Like it almost looks like that mother figure, like kind of teleported to the battle scene and then like use, like a huge burst of like white light energy to like right, right, incapacitate the droids.

Speaker 1 45:11

It was really cool and the night sisters. Their magic is like very, it's like green and it's very dark side. Yes, um intensive.

Speaker 2 45:21

And yeah, it's, it's they. They have a lot of like their. Their magic relies a lot of on like possession and, you know, like taking power from others.

Speaker 1 45:30

You know so right, right, like their, theirs is is like teetering more. It's like a dark magic, whereas like like if you were to think in terms of like, say like an rpg. Whereas, like the mountain clan uses white magic, they use the night sisters use dark magic or black magic.

Speaker 2 45:52

They're they're, they're the. They're the blood magic clan. Basically, yes, that was probably my favorite of the morgan elspeth um stories, just because it was the most unique. The other two were a little less impactful for me, I guess, but, on like, after thinking about it quite a bit, it does help bridge where this character is at the start of the mandalorian season two, as well as how she, you know, got involved with thrawn in the ahsoka series.

Speaker 1 46:26

Right, right. So I would say that those episodes were pretty essential for that, because it established and also it shows that, remember, when we meet her in the Mandalorian, the area around her is kind of it looks very just the land is scarred and is destroyed and like you see the start of that happen here and what's cool is that like you can kind of even pinpoint like where exactly it takes place on the timeline.

Speaker 2 46:59

because of that, because you have the new republic agent I forget her name, I wrote it down nadura, you, you have Nadura call out like a distress signal and then you know. If you're watching the show via, like with subtitles, like on Disney+, you'll see that the person who answered the call was none other than Bo-Katan Chris.

Speaker 1 47:24

Yes, I saw that.

Exploring Tales of Jedi & Empire

Speaker 2 47:26

Which is really cool. And then that kind of like oh, how does that connect? Oh, wait a minute, Bo-Katan Kryze knew that Ahsoka was on Corvus, which means that Bo-Katan Kryze, who picked up the distress call, must have sent Ahsoka to go help out those people on Corvus. And it all lines up. It's really cool.

Speaker 1 47:46

Dude, yeah, I didn't even think about that. Yeah, that's actually pretty cool because, yeah, we do get to a point where ahsoka is and that's right after the forest is all burned and you know, like ahsoka is like, basically like in the the smoke of the burnt forest, basically yeah yeah, yeah, you're right, the, the, the area is pretty foggy and stuff, yeah, and let that like like a smoke haze, you know.

Speaker 2 48:09

So yeah, no, that that was really cool.

Speaker 1 48:12

Um, and then we got her with that the best car spear, the best car spear we have the best car spear.

Speaker 2 48:19

I don't think they explain yeah, they don't explain how she got that. I wish that they did.

Speaker 1 48:23

That would have been cool, because I mean a story for another day. Yeah, it's like, how do you end up with the spear of, almost like Star Wars adamantium?

Speaker 2 48:35

Yeah, that's got to be worth more than most of your palace. Basically, it's interesting. There's so many ways that these few stories connect to each other. Um, and like the wider star wars, you know story I do want to talk a little bit about. Like you know, we we talked about tales of the jedi a little bit and how, like, the characters that it follows aren't jedi in the end but, um, in this story or tales of the empire, it kind of bookends with characters.

Speaker 2 49:11

So Morgan Elspeth wasn't part of the Empire, obviously, during the Clone Wars when her people were attacked, but she kind of developed into being one of the Empire's pawns or bishops, whatever you want to call it a chess-related idiom, empire's pawns or bishops, whatever you want to call it, just a chess related idiom. And then Beres Afi she kind of wakes up from prison becoming a cog in the Empire and then finds her way out of it. So the Beres Afi, all three Beres Afi stories take place during the Empire's reign. Only two of Morgan Elsbeth's stories take place during the empire's reign, or sorry, only one, only one the, the middle one, where she like kind of like brings up the tie defender program and that's what kind of catches thron's eye yes, yes, it's her arc touches, like each part of the this, like each of the the skywalker saga, like trilogies um clone wars the, you know the, the clone war era, the, the rebellion era and then, or the empire era and then the new republic era, you know so yeah, I thought that.

Speaker 2 50:22

I thought that was actually pretty cool, and so it's almost like tales of stories that revolve around the concept of the empire and like how the empire kind of shaped these individuals, which is kind of an interesting concept tales of the surrounding empire I would have liked at least one story that actually took place within like the original trilogy.

Speaker 2 50:44

You know, like there's so much that's kind of like the, the, the empire that everyone kind of thinks of you know, whereas, like from the jedi purge to the start of star wars, that's always kind of like the empire building strength in my mind, even though that's kind of like the empire's heyday technically within within universe, but like outside of the universe you think of like the original trilogy as of like the original trilogy, as being like the empire, you know and I always thought it was interesting because, like I mean now, now that you you mention it like a lot of it spent time within like the the inquisitors.

Speaker 1 51:21

Also, like half of the show it dealt with the inquisitors, but like, although that technically the inquisitors are part of the empire, I always saw them as like a rogue unit, like they're just their own thing, like yeah, technically they were empire, but they were kind of like they really only were doing, they only really cared for their own things, like the empire let them operate in the whatever way that they really wanted to. They're like hey, you know, take, take care of the jedi. You know that's really our or you know our orders for you to get rid of these guys, and other than that, they got to do really their own thing all right.

Speaker 2 52:01

Before we close this conversation, anthony, tell me two characters, both jedi and empire related, that you would like them to follow up on in a future season of either Tales of the Jedi or Tales of the Empire.

Speaker 1 52:17

Qui-Gon for Tales of the.

Speaker 2 52:19

Jedi. I like that. I like that. Qui-gon is so interesting.

Speaker 1 52:24

And Tales of the Empire.

Speaker 2 52:35

It's interesting, man inquisitor oh, that's interesting. Yeah, because we've never really gotten stories from his perspective like what's his deal, like what does he want from the world we need more about, like his past.

Speaker 1 52:43

I want to see what develops this man into the man that he was. Like dude, this man was like, honestly, to tell you the truth, like he was, like he I felt. Like he was just as evil as as the emperor. Like this man was like bad news. What, what, what, what made him that way? You know, like we, we, we know why Darth Vader became who he became.

Speaker 2 53:12

Palpatine would be interesting too yeah, we never really get stories around palpatine, even though he's kind of touched on everything right and we only know palpatine.

Speaker 1 53:24

Is there any prequel books with him outside of the Senate, like his early days?

Speaker 2 53:31

Not like, yeah, you do have. He kind of shows up in a couple.

Speaker 1 53:37

What about his master dude?

Speaker 2 53:40

No, we don't have any canonical information about Darth Plagueis. But we do have you know he does show up as a senator in a couple of the you know padme books that are that I do know prequel stories and the recent novel uh, the living force. He shows up in the beginning and the end. The end is really interesting actually.

Speaker 2 54:00

But yeah, that's, that's a discussion for another day but yeah, palpatine would be interesting and uh the characters I want right now, just just from this conversation, um, because we talked about him very briefly, I would like a. I would like a little trilogy of quinlan quinlan voss oh that, that would be cool because he's still alive by the time of obi-wan kenobi at. You know, supposedly like he, uh, there's. There's the line where uh obi-wan sees quinlan's name on the wall yes, I remember that.

Speaker 1 54:33

Yeah, that was crazy. Yeah, that was crazy that they I was like, oh my gosh, like somebody from the books, like made it into like the live action yeah, well, he was in.

Speaker 2 54:42

He was in clone war. He was in the show for a couple episodes but that's right, that's right yeah so I would like quinlan and, as far as the empire, either tarkin or thrawn. I don't think krennic is that interesting. I mean he is, but he isn't at the same time like he's.

Speaker 1 55:01

Just I don't think we need to know I don't think we need to know really more tarkin was more borderline crony, whereas Tarkin, there was a lot more deep going on with him. There was deeper things going on with him. Yeah, Really yeah. What set Thrawn on his path?

Speaker 2 55:27

That'd be interesting On his glorious path Guys, thank you so much for listening to us here for our 80th episode of Project Geekology. Next week we're covering X-Men 3, the Last Stand. It won't actually be the last that we'll see of the X-Men, but it will be the last of this trilogy and we're excited to talk about it. So join us next week as we cover all that. You can follow us on our socials. If you click down into the show notes, you'll find all the links to our personal socials as well as the podcast socials, so you don't miss any episodes that we come out with. And yeah, thanks for listening.

Speaker 1 56:05

And the applications to join the Inquisitors is also down there too.

Speaker 2 56:09

Yes, and be sure to provide your LinkedIn, because if you do not have your LinkedIn, you won't really get anywhere.

Speaker 1 56:21

Oh my gosh, alrighty, y'all have a good week.

Speaker 2 56:25

Later.